just for fun could we all watch and discuss?

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6 months 3 days ago #112841 by Shargrol
just saw this (it's old) and i'm watching now...

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6 months 3 days ago - 6 months 3 days ago #112842 by Shargrol
so funny, i couldn't watch the rick guy, so i just skipped to kenneth talking, and its all great kenneth stuff.... so nevermind! :D
Last edit: 6 months 3 days ago by Shargrol.

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6 months 2 days ago - 6 months 1 day ago #112844 by Frank
Thanks for the link! Quite different world views, Neo Advaita vs. Pragmatic Dharma, always fun to watch :) ... We could have certainly seen more head-butting, but maybe they were *too* far from each other to get the sparks flying.

(Kenneth comes across a bit condescending. Do you know him personally? I wonder if this video from 2015 is representative for his current teaching or might it be just another phase like the "unity" one he touched upon briefly in the interview?)

It was interesting to hear Kenneth talk about nibbana and rebirth or the lack thereof being pretty much irrelevant for Westerners. Still, he doesn't doubt the validity of the Buddhist project, because understanding dukkha and realizing the end of dukkha, in one's lifetime, still make sense as a path. I would've liked the interviewer to be more inquisitive there, like "how authentic is pick-and-choose?" or something along those lines.

Kenneth doesn't believe that humans can apprehend an ultimate reality where all filters fall away and you "see". There can be a *sense* of this happening, though, and it can be beautiful and freeing, to a certain extent. Such experiencing runs the risk of becoming self-validating, though. I believe this was well put by Kenneth. He seems to advocate an stance of reductionism to iron out any priviledging. "It's a lense, and it's possible to fetishize that lense".

When it comes to "meditation B" (i.e. noting; A: shamatha etc.), though, he falls in the same trap he finds the interviewer caught in. Why should one priviledge 3C over, say, a view of a universal field of awareness, if it's all lenses?

"Realizing your own potential with incremental gains" seemed to be a direction which resonated with both, and a good springboard into a discussion about attention as a finite resource and mindfulness vs concentration. In the context of the cat looking at the gopher hole ("concentration"), Kenneth's definition of mindfulness as "recursive self-awareness" resonated with me, although that idiom makes the dualism of his method even more prominent. Disappointing that he didn't want to try to name the 7 Factors of Awakening, after having used the 2 (mindfulness + concentration) to underline his approach to teaching meditation.

With regards to the presentation of what it means to "make the subject into object": Intuitively, it is sensible to see a shedding of a filter I had just been looking through (or being embedded in) as a process of gradual disidentification. I find his hypothesis of "filter = subject" not entirely convincing. The idea of the "developmental window of awakening", on the other hand, is enticing - - although I suspect it's that Western goal-orientation that is rearing its head in my psyche :)
Last edit: 6 months 1 day ago by Frank.
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6 months 1 day ago #112847 by Chris Marti
Since he recently revealed this online, I'll state here that Kenneth is on the autism spectrum, so you have to take that into account when you interact with him or see him interact with others. I'm a friend of Kenneth's and was a student of Kenneth's for a while way back when. He has gone through multiple versions of his dharma teachings, so it's always a good idea to ask your question, Frank - "Which version am I seeing here?"
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5 months 4 weeks ago #112849 by Junglist
Thanks for the post Shargrol, I thought I'd seen it but hadn't.
It was indeed great Kenneth stuff, very clear and sensible.
I liked, among other things, how he explained the radicalness of what the Buddha said in the context of all experience and nibbana.
I also liked how a couple of times Rick seemed to be bargaining for the woowoo stuff to be true. :whistle: Maybe one of my favourite bits was when Kenneth responded with, "...No"
To be fair, it seemed worthwhile of Rick to challenge what could come across as nonchalance from Kenneth, although I think not being indifferent to experience is something he implied in couple of places.
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5 months 3 weeks ago #112885 by Kacchapa
This got me watching some of Kenneth's other youtubes again. It's sobering that he went from enlightenment is possible for anyone to - of course not everyone is going to become a world-class athlete.
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