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Everything is Everything (practice notes)

  • mudstick
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68561 by mudstick
Hope it's okay for me to start sharing notes here. I figure having notes public will give me more of an obligation to actually write stuff down. Also I had a nice event yesterday so I thought it would be a good time to start sharing.
  • NikolaiStephenHalay
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68562 by NikolaiStephenHalay
Replied by NikolaiStephenHalay on topic RE: Everything is Everything (practice notes)
Yes, welcome mudstick. You'll get more advice from lots of advanced yogis. ;)

Looking forward to your updates.

Mudita
  • mudstick
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68563 by mudstick
Replied by mudstick on topic RE: Everything is Everything (practice notes)
Sunday (yesterday)

Had just written with Nick Halay, I told him I was planning on doing a concentration only practice for the time beeing but he mentioned that noting was a more effecient way of climbing the stratas. I figured I try it again since he and everybody else seems to be doing it.

Did about 15-20min noting early in the day. (no timer)
Started of pleasant, then unpleasant, then neutral. I moved up and down this feeling-pattern but always in that order. The only thing that broke this up was a feeling of "going down the rabbit hole"; a rush of sensations, my head being pushed back, but it felt like I can't get to "the other side", whatever that means. Snap out of it almost right away. Quit when my head started to hurt, and felt spaced out. Not really impressed with noting at this point. (Noting technique here was terrible and all over the place, figured out what was wrong later (see below)).

Later in the day I did what felt like about 20min (no timer).
Was fed up with noting, did concentration only, followed the breath and got into a really relaxed state where the breath flows 100% unrestricted. Felt even more spaced out after, and also fed up. Felt weird and depressed with little energy the rest of the day.

  • mudstick
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68564 by mudstick
Replied by mudstick on topic RE: Everything is Everything (practice notes)
That same evening I read trough mumuwu's practice notes and I felt inspired before going to bed. Figured I would try noting one last time. Also remembered Nick told me he usually follows the breath while noting so I had that in mind while lying in bed meditating. It started like normal, almost immediately got in to the happy pleasant state, struggled back and forth with this a bit as I lost my focus. Tried to anchor my self to the breath and by doing that the obvious hit me: I need to stay in the present. I have read this many times but like usual I'm to stupid to actually try it. I really need to remember this, so big note to self: You are the train station, you do not go to meet the trains, you do not follow after the trains, you simply notice the ones that stop or pass by. (Use just as much concentration as you need to stay present.) Things got easier when I realized this; when I fell out of the present I just noted my self back. This really got my into new territory.
  • mudstick
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68567 by mudstick
Replied by mudstick on topic RE: Everything is Everything (practice notes)
I notice that "self"/"I"/ego is still very apparent at this state as you probably noticed. Also as I was thinking (verbal thoughts) I was always aware that I was thinking although I didn't try to note anything. The state was probably biased by the fact that I was feeling depressed the whole day, and also that it's the first time I've felt anything like this so stabilized. It will be interseting to see if I can access this state again later, and what it will feel like. I'm definitely sticking with noting practice for a while as it seem to be much more effiecient than just pure concentration (thanks Nick). I think my mind needs time to get used to being concentrated as the forehead felt tense during the meditation although physically I was totally relaxed.

(Sorry about my bad sentence structure and whatnot; English is a second language to me)
  • mudstick
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68566 by mudstick
Replied by mudstick on topic RE: Everything is Everything (practice notes)
At this time I felt no reason to note any further so I just played around with the good feeling. The beauty was that the more I embraced the niceness the nicer it got (Unlike in daily life where at the moment you ask "am I happy?" you stop being happy). This state had the feeling-tone of "everything's gonna be alright". I asked myself "do I have any problems?", the answer was immediately "no". It was funny because normally this would spark a brainstorm and a big internal debate on how many problems I have. I asked myself again "Really? Just a few minutes ago you seemed to have enough to complain about, are you sure there is absolutely nothing?" Answer right away: "nope". At this time I was really just feeding the state; thinking stuff like "I should just sell everything I own and move to a pacific island where you (the state) and me can just love each other until I die". I'm embarrassed to write this now, as it all seem so silly, but it is what I felt at the time. I'm also glad I write this a day after or it would've just been a five page long poem which would definitively backfire once I inevitably hit rock bottom at later time.
  • mudstick
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68565 by mudstick
Replied by mudstick on topic RE: Everything is Everything (practice notes)
I remember reading in mumuwu's notes that he was talking a lot about physical sensations as are everybody else. Up until now I have been thinking that they most be really thorough to notice so subtle sensations. But at this time I was feeling bubbling sensations in my stomach and chest, don't remember much detail other then that the sensations were really noticeable and intense in relation to what I normally feel. I also can't remember if I felt this during the pleasant first period or the unpleasant period that followed. When I got into the unpleasant period I thought maybe I should just quit and go to sleep as it really had the feeling tone of "I don't need this sheet". Almost giving up actually helped because I surrendered more (I think). Anyway when I got out of that landscape I entered into a state of total freedom and pleasantness. I've never experienced a state like this before, or at least not that stable. While the most pleasant states I've hit upon before where explosive and had more of a peak quality this state felt more like a plateau.
  • NikolaiStephenHalay
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68568 by NikolaiStephenHalay
Replied by NikolaiStephenHalay on topic RE: Everything is Everything (practice notes)
Your English is great and easy to understand. Keep up the solid noting practice and you will find it hard NOT to progress. Just some advice about your practice thread. In order for others to be able to see exactly what you are ding in your practice, post very detailed accounts of what is going on in the sits, sensations, tones, mind states, thoughts etc. without speculating about where you are on the map of insight. This way others can see and relate to what is going on in your practice and will be able to offer helpful advice and see your progress.

Keep it up!
:)
Nick
  • mudstick
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68569 by mudstick
Replied by mudstick on topic RE: Everything is Everything (practice notes)
Monday

20min sit:

Started with settling in to the body trying to stay present.
Began noting, a lot of thoughts regarding noting, a lot of bystander commentary.
Some shooting pains from different areas in the body. Tightness in the forehead.
Feeling-tone is grungy mixed with heaviness. Repeating thoughts, effort in trying to adjust my focus. Craving for a different feeling-tone. Noticed a different very subtle thought-stream that was running in parallel to the more apparent one. Head very tight. Tingling from right leg falling asleep. More of a neutral feeling-tone near the end but with an undercurrent of morbidness.

---

Glad I was able to stick trough more of a grindstone meditation as those seem to be what I learn from. Still a lot of craving for pleasure even though I'm noting it.
  • mudstick
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68570 by mudstick
Replied by mudstick on topic RE: Everything is Everything (practice notes)
Tuesday

20min sit:

Started with focusing on the breath to build a stable platform to note from.
Noted that there are some overlooking thoughts that is mistaken for "me": The one who notes how the noting is going, the one that think it's time to change sitting position, the one that wonders how much time is left.
Also tried looking at myself from "outside"; awareness of someone being aware of my awareness; the triangle is complete. No surprise my head started to hurt pretty quickly (like a ring tightened around my skull) so I dropped that.
I'm really getting fascinated by the body energy. Once I sync up my mind, body and breath, it's like I connect the power cable to the wall-socket. I feel bubbling sensations up and down my thighs and torso.

---
I like to experiment with different techniques but it's clear I need to plan out what to do before meditating, so that I don't have the option to switch mid-sit.
  • mumuwu
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68571 by mumuwu
Mud,

This sounds really great. I would suggest (and this is just a suggestion based on what worked for me, feel free to ignore it) you start with the awareness of breath as per usual, but make a resolution upon sitting to note what arises without looking for anything or manipulating the experience. It may be boring at times, but the idea is to get a really good feel for the mind's strata, which is best done by allowing them to arise naturally (as they inevitably will when you balance concentration and mindfulness). This is also a great way to avoid a problem I have run into in the past. There are certain things which you'll have an aversion to and so you might setup your practice as a way to avoid those. Sitting and watching what comes, as it comes, will allow you to sink (or rise if you like that better) through the layers of the mind in a natural way.

So upon sitting resolve to note whatever the most prevalent sensation or experience is and continue to note it (being mindful of changes in it in real time) until something else becomes more interesting, and then you move to that). Eg. (itching, negative, itching negative, itching negative, tingling neutral, tingling neutral, warmth positive, Joy, practice thought, joy, pulsing neutral, etc.)

Also, be aware that there are four areas you will want to investigate. They are sensation, feeling tone (negative, positive, or neutral - each sensation will have an associated feeling tone), mindstates (emotions, curiosity, looking, contentment, etc. there are some good examples under the meditation instructions in the 1st gear part of the site) and thoughts. A good way to do this is to start on the level of sensations until you get a good feel for it. Then start pairing each sensation with a feeling tone. Try to note mind states or thoughts as you become aware of them as well.

Best of luck!
  • mudstick
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68572 by mudstick
Replied by mudstick on topic RE: Everything is Everything (practice notes)
Thanks for the suggestions mumuwu!

I know what you are saying about the concentration balanced with mindfulness because on "a good day" I hit the right balance point and it feels so right. I think my mindfulness is good for the time being but my concentration could use some work, will try to get even more focused on the breath before I start noting because I have a tendency to lose presentness (wow that's a word) and reach around for sensations. I should also be more formal in labeling the sensations, that's just me being lazy.

Feel I have a good idea on what I need to work on for now and I hope people will direct my along the path. Looks like I'm the greenest on this site meaning there's a lot of experienced people to learn from.

  • mumuwu
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68573 by mumuwu
Yeah, I suggest you try the Kasina (extremely simple, extremely effective, no need to develop skills that can take a long time to get right). Good noting practice will also get you deeply concentrated via Khanika Samahdhi.

"The kinds of concentration discussed so far arise by fixing the mind upon a single object to the exclusion of other objects. But apart from these there is another kind of concentration which does not depend upon restricting the range of awareness. This is called "momentary concentration" (khanika-samadhi). To develop momentary concentration the meditator does not deliberately attempt to exclude the multiplicity of phenomena from his field of attention. Instead, he simply directs mindfulness to the changing states of mind and body, noting any phenomenon that presents itself; the task is to maintain a continuous awareness of whatever enters the range of perception, clinging to nothing. As he goes on with his noting, concentration becomes stronger moment after moment until it becomes established one-pointedly on the constantly changing stream of events. Despite the change in the object, the mental unification remains steady, and in time acquires a force capable of suppressing the hindrances to a degree equal to that of access concentration. This fluid, mobile concentration is developed by the practice of the four foundations of mindfulness, taken up along the path of insight; when sufficiently strong it issues in the breakthrough to the last stage of the path, the arising of wisdom."
---From-http://www.vipassana.com/resources/8fp7.php

Kasina practice will help with laziness and all sorts of other "defilements." It sets up a good space for practice. One tip, when you first sit with the Kasina you will find yourself getting agitated and you'll want to get up and do something else. Use a timer and force yourself to sit through it, your mind will eventually capitulate and get concentrated.
  • mudstick
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68574 by mudstick
Replied by mudstick on topic RE: Everything is Everything (practice notes)
Wednesday

20min, kasina (candlelight)

Painful! The whole room flickered in something resembling the glowing edges effect from photoshop. Didn't do any noting or following the breath juts stared at the flame. Got really tense around the eyes and forehead. After about 15min I had to close my eyes because of the pain. I think I focus my eyes more than I should; it doesn't feel relaxed. Doesn't feel like I got any more concentrated/relaxed/absorbed then I was before starting. Just with an added headache. My contacts becomes all foggy from the staring as well. Think I'm gonna stick with noting/breathing for the time being:)

  • mumuwu
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68575 by mumuwu
Have you tried breath counting (count 1 on in, 2 on out. Count up to 10). That's another super effective and easy method of getting concentrated. But whatever works for you.

I find the candle flame takes a lot longer to work than colored discs which you'll find outlined under the 1st gear section of the site. Have you read through the site?
  • mudstick
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68576 by mudstick
Replied by mudstick on topic RE: Everything is Everything (practice notes)
Yes, I usually count the breath until concentration is stable. Then once it's stable I start noting while still following the breath. Seems to be what's working best for me from what I've tried so far.
  • NikolaiStephenHalay
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68577 by NikolaiStephenHalay
Replied by NikolaiStephenHalay on topic RE: Everything is Everything (practice notes)
Hey mudstick,

You gotta know how much effort to put into it and when to relax. Trust your intuition there. If you can maintain focus on the flame, but also let the body relax and the eyes also relax, then do that. If you are finding you are staring "too hard", then purposefully relax your eyes and let the eyelids droop a bit. THis helps me develop a gentle stare. THink of the buddha staring out from his lotus posture. his eyes are very relaxed but not too relaxed to appear like he is falling asleep. He is relaxedly staring intently. Play with it!

:)

Edited to include: If it is too much for you, try a round kasina object which is much larger than a flame. It may be more relaxing on the eyes. The colour should be one that is relaxing and easy to stare at. Counting the breath is good too.
  • mudstick
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68578 by mudstick
Replied by mudstick on topic RE: Everything is Everything (practice notes)
Just did a 60min meditation.
Mostly experimenting with different approaches to awareness. Even though I'm not used to sitting for that long at a time it wasn't hard to do. Was hoping it was gonna be more more eventful though. In broad terms it seems to go from not relaxed to relaxed and thats it. It's really soothing and nice but I don't feel like I'm progressing during the sit. Hehe it's taking me like one minute per word to write now, my thoughts are really numb.
  • mumuwu
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68579 by mumuwu
Don't be afraid of having a nice sit lol. Every sit teaches you something. Just make sure to keep journaling so if a pattern of clinging develops you can pick it up. Sounds lovely!
  • mudstick
  • Topic Author
15 years 3 months ago #68580 by mudstick
Replied by mudstick on topic RE: Everything is Everything (practice notes)
Tried some Shikantaza today since I read Alex wrote about it.
20min

I just did nothing in the beginning, or I just made sure I didn't get taken by any thoughts or sensations. I went pretty deep fairly quick. Felt really rooted. Like I was sinking trough layers of mind from top to bottom, after a while it felt like I was down in the body and I was aware of the breath all by my self, without really trying. At this level there was also some emotional discharge:) Noticed though that I had to be careful at that level not to get drowsy so I had to ramp up the awareness. All in all a very very natural and organic way of meditating.
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