Knots, tensions and vulnerability (via betawave)

In Laurel's practoce thread, betawave made the following very insightful comment:

>Maybe you're understanding the purification that comes from going to the center of dukka.
>
>At first we want to avoid, create a position for ourselves that is superior, only to find that we've separated ourselves from others, our body, our self. Most people spend their entire live building up the superior position, watching it fall apart, then trying to build it up again. Others notice the pattern and wonder, why the heck do I keep doing that? But maybe they just stop at wondering.
>
>Others go deeper into feeling the sensation of all of these drives, the drive for the superior position, the drive to call oneself a horrible person, the drive to become a great meditator, [the drive to write to write pretentious stuff like this! ], the drive to become something better. Why all those drives? What are we trying to fix?
>
>And then we start looking inward, first finding the knots, then finding the energy of the knots, then we find ourselves in the center of the energy, and inside there is insight.
>
>Stop too soon and you just become someone that can talk about knots and make more stories about knots. Keep going and you will know the truth of the knot --- and know the release and compassion that automatically results from that intimate knowing of these vunerabilities at the center of the knots. If it doesn't hit close to home, it probably isn't the center of the knot.
>
>This work isn't about antidotes, it's simply about really feeling the poison. The rest just happens from that direct experience.

Anyone who has read my practice thread will know that bodily tension is my number one source of dukkha, so I found betawave's comments particularly helpful. But I have a few questions....

[cont...]

[...cont]
I've been wondering just how 'getting to the centre' of the knots works out in practice. I used to deliberately try and relax muscular tension that arose in meditation, often getting sucked into the area of tension and trying to "work it out" to the exclusion of the rest of my experience. I now realise that this was an aversive reaction, and now I sit with it, feeling the pain, getting to the centre as much as I can, and then the compassion arises and it releases somewhat. The problem is then that the aversion gets very subtle - I want to go in, accept and release so that it will go away. So I note that aversion and continue. But then (and here's the question) can even paying attention to the knots, and 'really feeling the poision' actually manifest a kind of aversion, because I know that the sooner I feel the poison, the sooner they (might) go away?

I think one has to let go of trying to make them go away. Because that is fundamentally aversive, even if it's quite a subtle aversion. Instead, just hold them lightly. Notice them. Be with them just as they are. They *release themselves* when the grasping and aversion fades. Again it's that circular thing where if you try to get rid of the grasping or aversion through some kind of deliberate action you are...enacting more grasping and aversion! The key is to just allow them to be, as if cradling them gently, looking with a soft eye at whatever arises, even if that is a deep vulnerability, fear, etc. And if fear, aversion, etc arises, that too is held lightly. And on and on. And just that will allow the knots to untie themselves in their own time. Not always easy, but if one can bring a sense of curiosity to the process (rather than "I will get rid of this stuff dammit!") that helps a lot, I find. ETA: someone uses the term "radical acceptance" I think? That's a useful attitude, I think. "This, too." is another way to say it.

I can say that in my case I really did not want to feel that poison. There are excellent reasons why we resist feeling it--because when we (or should I say I?) finally do it is traumatic at first. So you may think you're trying to get to the center of it and really you'd rather not. What happened to me is there was a trigger--something someone told me--and then the resistance kicked in, but the resistance began to wobble and falter on its own and then the breakthrough happened. And when it happened it was spontaneous, but it also hurt and there were a lot of tears and pain; it is painful to realize how much suffering I have caused myself and others for so long. A part of me still wants to construct at least a temporary shelter from it--maybe a lean-to? But gradually it works itself out, at least I expect so.

For physical stuff, right now I'm pursuing tai chi, although I have to say I haven't been practicing that much yet. But I think maybe a physical practice or bodywork can at least help with what's ailing you. Working on your body isn't aversive, it's just self-care. I see it as a balance for the sitting meditation.

Yeah, it's a fine line.

If you rush into investigating knots when you aren't solid, you will recoil in fear and gain no benefit.
If you avoid investingating knots when you are able, you miss out on progress.
If you overly focus on investigating knots, you might be solidifying the practice into something that helps you avoid other things!


There is a saying that stuck in my head, I think maybe from Chogram Trungpa "our practice is like taking nice walks through a town that always wind up passing through the graveyard". What I think he is pointing towards is we're always drawn to the quiet and peace that comes from these practices, like a quiet country graveyard, but at certain points we realize, holy s**t! I'm in a f**king graveyard and surrounded by rotting corpses! There's no need to leave the graveyard, it still really is a quiet and peaceful place, we just have to get used to our insight. Same thing with meditation. It will be calm, it will be scary, and if we sit with the scary, it will be calm again, maybe even more deeply calm.

That's a good analogy. Cute. It's very true that one cannot expect that sitting with/investigating things will mean "ah, a nice smooth experience" - it often is part of a very bumpy erratic sort of experience. That's okay. Bumpy is the nature of the path, especially when things are going deeper, ime. It might be as bumpy as a speeding jeep on a bad road and you in the back with no seatbelt. That's okay, too. Don't want the experience to be a certain way (and since you will anyway, just notice that, too.)

I wonder if you people here think it is valuable to set a timer and then just sit through it, the physical pain i mean. we did this on the goenka retreat, and it seems to make one calm and less reactive. not that i am advocating self-torture, which is apparently a means to enlightenment which is employed somewhat in various schools. (shinzen young talks about his experience of what was essentially a form of torture). Do you think this approach of sitting for a fixed time, even if your pain is severe, is helpful?

I used a timer - 30 minutes - for years. I still do sometimes, though I've pretty much got an automatic timer in my head by now from doing 30 minute sessions for so long. If I wanted to sit more in a day I'd sit additional 30 minute sessions. Not using a timer is a pain: you tend to keep checking the time, wondering about the time which interrupts your focus; you tend to "cheat" and get up early if the session is unpleasant. I use that Insight Timer app for iPhone. You can even set gentle bells for five minute intervals (or whenever) which is helpful if you are having a lot of distraction.

Thanks for the helpful responses everyone.

@giragirasol - radical acceptance is a helpful term. Beth has been teaching me the phrase "This is exactly what I want". Both are challenging! The gentleness is an important pointer which I always need reminding of.

@betawave - I really like the graveyard analogy. It makes me think you must be based somewhere on this side of the Atlantic - the UK, Ireland, France maybe - cos sleepy little parish graveyards are not something I've ever encountered in the US Anwyay, I like the idea of our own personal charnal ground.

@JackWick - I did a Goenka retreat last year and found the determination sits (where you are strongly encouraged not to move for an hour) were enormously helpful in encouraging me to be less aversive. Sometimes it is torture and you sit through pain cursing Goenka and the practice. But then you see that really it just makes it worse. So you start investigating and the pain breaks up into heat or tingles, or passes away entirely. I found this easier with pain in the legs - pain in the back and shoulders is still caught up with a lot of anxiety, fear and anger. So yes, I think it can be really helpful to sit like this from time to time. I seem to remember Shinzen Young recommends sitting for two hours (!) without moving every now and again, just to get your game back up to retreat level.

@Laurel - I guess I just need to be more patient! I am doing lots of physical stuff around this - Qigong, Pilates, stretching and physiotherapy. But my physio said to me that although the physical tension has eased off since I've been seeing her, I still have a "pain memory" which repeats itself and will take time to pass. Now is that a sankhara or what?!?

FYI - the iPhone comes with a perfectly good meditation timer right out of the box. It's part of the Alarm app. Just set the timer in the timer tab for however many minutes you want to practice. No need to download or (gasp!) buy anything unless you want pretty pictures and nice bells.

Nice bells FTW! Likewise one can use an oven timer or even a (old school) alarm clock.

"@betawave - I really like the graveyard analogy. It makes me think you must be based somewhere on this side of the Atlantic - the UK, Ireland, France maybe - cos sleepy little parish graveyards are not something I've ever encountered in the US Anwyay, I like the idea of our own personal charnal ground."

The only Irish betawave is close to are at the University of Notre Dame or on the south side of Chicago

Andy, we have thousands of sleepy little graveyards in the U.S. They tend to be in small towns, not big cities. Tourists visiting from other lands tend to stick to the big cities so they miss the sleepy little towns with their sleepy little graveyards.

"
FYI - the iPhone comes with a perfectly good meditation timer right out of the box. It's part of the Alarm app. Just set the timer in the timer tab for however many minutes you want to practice. No need to download or (gasp!) buy anything unless you want pretty pictures and nice bells.



"

Okay, dumb question: do you have to have an iPhone to use this app, or can you get it with another kind of smart phone?

There seems to be an android version? I think it's the same one. www.spotlightsix.com/android-meditation-timer/

(ETA: I'm referring to the Insight Timer mentioned above...)

To use the Apple iPhone Alarm app you need an iPhone. I'm sure Android has it's own timer app.

@Laurel - I use Meditation Helper for Android. play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=co...lex.meditation&hl=en