Hello and a energy flow question

Hello Everyone,
I'm Ken and I am new here. I just wanted to say hello and say thanks to you all for such a great site. I thought it might be a good idea to introduce myself and ask an inconsequential question instead of having my first post be a "OMG this crazy thing happened" post. I did my first one on one with Kenneth today and it was extremely helpful, as I am sure many of you are aware. I have watched and read a lot of his material and it was really quite 'neat' how he was able to pick up what my personal experience is like and tailor the standard exercises to fit where I am at and how I am experiencing things. Definitely helped me to be on my way to getting over some obstacles.
So, with that being said, I won't ask any 'practice specific' questions at this time as it seems obvious at the moment that I just need to put these new techniques to work and do some practice with them for a while.
I do have a curiosity about my experience that I'd like to ask about though, as it seems related not to my noting or meditation practice but maybe related in some way to one of the other "Gears".
I've felt my energy body tangibly for a good while and for some time I have had this er... capacity(?) to, what I label in my own head as, 'blow my mind empty'. Basically I just breath the current of my energy stronger and stronger out through my crown and let the energy kind of 'rinse' my mind and after only a few breaths like this my mind just sits there blankly. I feel like I am just sitting inside an empty skull kinda looking around stupidly but quite aware. It's a different feeling than the mahamudra 'listening for ships' technique, but possibly similar. Is this something with a label or just an energy parlor trick? Is there some specific use I could put this to?

Thanks,
Ken

I've done that on occasion, the first time by accident, then a few more times because it was a novelty ("hey, check this out!"). I think it falls in the "parlor tricks" category - I can't think of any particular reason it would be useful, any more than a plunge into a cold shower or other shocks to the system that kind of stun the brain for a moment. That said, if it happens accidentally/spontaneously and you simply maintain your meditation practice (whichever method you have been told to do), you may be able to observe the same things in that state that you observe in other states (including ordinary consciousness), such as the way all phenomena arise and pass away and so on.

This to everyone in general, because I've been there done that and every one I know does the same thing: altered states are really fascinating novelties which you can train yourself to access or can happen spontaneously during meditation. It's inevitable that one gets really into altered states because they are cool and interesting, but don't get sidetracked: the "job" to do in meditation is close attention to the moment. Whether that moment is noisy, quiet, exciting, boring, happy, sad, in an altered state or not, just apply the technique you are using (watching the breath, noting, 3rd gear, whatever). THAT is the practice.

Sounds like an experience of jhana, Ken. It is tied to the breath, increasingly powerful as the breaths are taken in lockstep with the feeling of energy. Doing what you describe here caused me to attain my first fruition.

BTW - giragirasol doesn't do jhana practices, so she won't see it the way I do (jokingly offered). But for real, they aren't parlor tricks. They're not the be all and end all, but they're useful as lubrication for a noting vipassana practice, and they are somehow inextricably tied to all the stages of insight.

Chris, I cross posted with you. Willing to disagree on this, however.

I just disagreed You don't do jhanas much at all that I know of so I can see how what Ken is saying would appear to be a sort of throw away practice. And, as always, I could be wrong and he's fooling himself, just now with my help.

Hi giragirasol and cmarti, thanks for your replies. It wasn't that long ago that I learned the technique for acquiring jhanas and this isn't really the same thing. With what I am talking about everything just becomes very still and quiet, and it's fragile. There isn't the rising quality to the mind and there isn't the continuation of the blissful rising energy. If it is anything it 'seems' more related to direct path type techniques. It is a very calming and relaxing experience, takes your head out of the game... I tend to agree with giragirasol about this particular phenom, if only because I've never really had the faculty to investigate it. I'm certainly not on a quest for altered states or entertaining myself. Although I do consistently practice jhanas to use as a tool for investigation and I agree with you on that cmarti. I don't know if I can really "investigate" from there or if it's just watching, I know noting wrecks the state I'm referring to. If there isn't a specific tool to apply and use this state in a tried and proven way, then it would seem a waste of time when there are so many proven tools that do the job. One thing I have used it for from time to time is just transitioning between tasks/things I have to think about. It gives mixed results, sometimes it clears the slate other times the content is sticky and persistent and just comes back when I go back to thinking.

My take on it being that being awake has everything to do with being fully present in the moment exactly as it is, and nothing to do with being in a deliberately generated daze, a trance, or an eyes-rolled-back-cosmic orgasm. ETA: of course, a variety of extreme states can sometimes be helpful in noticing the ultimate unsatisfactoriness and impermanence of such things...

But you're right, I've had little jhana experience, and if they are useful and are suggested by those who know what they are talking about (like Chris and Kenneth Folk) then go for it.

"It wasn't that long ago that I learned the technique for acquiring jhanas and this isn't really the same thing."

Do you have any jhana experiences to compare this experience to?

Yes, I guess I missed making my point on that. I've been working with 1-4 for about a month now. Sometimes just working on the states themselves, seeing it, entering it, being in it, leaving it... and more often just moving through them to 4th to start investigating the state itself, my understanding of doing vipassana in a concentrated jhanic state.
The difference as I perceive it is that the 'blown mind' state is very still, all over and it's my entire head that is empty. And it's more of a soft mind than a concentrated one. My exp with jhana is that energetically 1 is very active a lot of continuous flowing and the 'emptiness' of mind there is a much smaller 'pocket' of emptiness under my crown chakra. The perception of the energy flow gets more distant and less coarse as I move up thru jhana and as I go into third I am not as aware of the pocket of emptiness as the focus broadens out and then in 4th I am pretty detached from body and mind is very spacious and much less defined. And there is rising thru 1st & 2 then a spreading in third and full expansion in 4th while the blown mind thing has no rising it is very physical, in my physical head feeling.

I don't have the breath or crown related to it, but I found that after SE I can sometimes more or less say/think/incline the concept of "still" to the mind and the narrative ceases. The label of "soft" resonates as well. Kind of a 2nd/3rd gear type of thing, but specifically non-narrative, it's like that whole section is gently partitioned off. I imagine Gangaji saying "just stop." Not that there's anything wrong with narrative. There's kind of a whole direction I think of there that I have previously labelled as "nondual," kind of an advaitic pointer. Doing it right now it does feel a little bit concentrated but I'm not sure it is specifically a jhana in my case.