Concentration, Ease, Rapture, Intention, Eye-Balls Fluttering

Hello, Everyone

I'd like to relate an experience I've had a few times lately in meditation, partially because I want to get better at reporting and describing these things, responding to feedback / questions, and also partially because it sounds a little like something I read on one of these forums, and it occurred to me that various people might recognize where I am and offer recommendations.

So, a few days ago, I started practicing a hand-motion Vipassana exercise to improve momentary concentration. This is an exercise where one sits with hands on knees and slowly lifts the right hand off one's knee, so that the sides of the hand and pinky finger sit flush against the knee, then raises the arm, lowers the arm back down so that the hand is touching the knee, then places it palm down on the knee again, rests, and then repeats, then switches to the left hand.

So, I did this exercise for the instructed 10 minutes, then switched to the rising - falling of the abdomen exercise, and as soon as I sat and simply rested (before making a resolution to maintain mindfulness of the abdomen) my eyeballs began fluttering rapidly up in my eye sockets. This was (at least consciously) unexpected and involuntary. Then I made my resolution, including "other sensations" in my resolution, to pay respect to the fluttering sensation. Sure enough, when I sat and began noting rising - falling, the fluttering returned, and continued with eyes open (what we might normally call blinking, with eyeballs inclined to roll up in the eye sockets, though this was more rapid then normal blinking.) The rest of the sit included a lot of pain up and down the spinal column, especially around the area on the same latitude as the solar plexus (behind it).

Cont. below

Just now, I read one of Chris's posts describing surrender and letting concentration do its thing.

kennethfolkdharma.wetpaint.com/thread/31...set=80&maxResults=20

Feeling inspired, I sat and closed my eyes, concentrated on nothing in particular, just the sense of knowing, I suppose, within a few seconds some goose-flesh rapture arose, and then the thought of fluttering arose, and then fluttering arose, rapid as before. Maybe someone else sees a better way to approach this sort of thing, but the way I'm investigating it now is how these elements interrelate: the concentration, the ease and rapture arising, the intention or thought of the fluttering, and the fluttering itself. As of now, all I can say is that they seem to happen in that order, but I'm honestly feeling pretty bewildered about the use of the whole thing and why I'm even posting this. In other words, meditation appears beneficial but obscure at the moment. Does that make any sense? I like it, it helps me in life, but I feel like there's something lurking in the experience that is teasing me, something peeking out and getting my attention without giving enough information to really allow satisfaction. Haha. Sounds like Dukkha. Well, that's funny until a sense of dread creeps in. Then the dread itself seems funny. Then it seems 'real' again. Weird. Anything you all can offer by way of assistance or acclimation or clarifying questions is much appreciated.

Peace,
Ryan

Hi Ryan,

Focus on the fluttering of the eyelids. Is it continuous? Do the flutters come in waves? Incline your mind toward the ending of each wave of fluttering. What happens when the flutters stop?

Kenneth

Hello Ryan,

I am reminded of an excerpt from Jack Kornfield's book "A Path With Heart" that may be helpful for you at this time in your practice...

"Early in one year-long training retreat, I experienced a period of very powerful release where my head began shaking back and forth for hours. Some days later my arms started to involuntarily flap like a bird's wings. When I would try to stop them, I could barely do so. If I relaxed at all, they would flap continuously. They did so for several days. When I asked the teacher about it, he inquired whether I was being fully aware, and I said, 'Certainly.' Later he said, 'You're not really being aware. Look more carefully and you will see that you don't like it. You subtly want it to go away.' When I saw he was right, he said, 'Simply go back and observe it,' and over the next two days the movement subsided, and I sat there feeling my arms throb, bringing hours of deep bodily release...

(continued)

(continued from above)

..."These spontaneous bodily releases are neither enlightening nor harmful. They are simply what happens when the energy being generated in our practice encounters blocks and tightness where it cannot flow... When these spontaneous movements appear, we can begin to respect how deep our physical patterns of holding can be. For many students, physical releases and openings take place over months and years of their spiritual practice. It is best to meet these movements by softening, especially relaxing the back and the area at the base of the spine. if the release is only moderately strong, it is often best to try to relax and yet hold the body still in the face of it and allow the energy to push open new channels in the body, rather than be released in movement. For stronger release this is impossible, though there are ways to temper and soften the buildup and flow of energy. As we become concentrated, the energy of our body system will follow a natural process of opening and balancing itself. We will feel how the heat, pulsations, and vibrations spontaneously move through our spine to open blocked energy channels and then radiate out to every nerve and cell of our body. We can discover that some of the deepest healing and body work can take place as we sit still and meditate. Remember that this can be a long process, so be patient with your body."

~Jackson

"(continued from above)

..."These spontaneous bodily releases are neither enlightening nor harmful. They are simply what happens when the energy being generated in our practice encounters blocks and tightness where it cannot flow... As we become concentrated, the energy of our body system will follow a natural process of opening and balancing itself..."

~Jackson"

Hi Jackson,
Thanks for posting the Kornfield quote. By coincidence, I just posted the following on the Mystery thread:

kennethfolkdharma.wetpaint.com/thread/3468527/Mystery

7. RE: Mystery
. . .
Hi Adam,
I think you are on to something here. But as they say "the devil is in the details." To say that there is "a direct correlation between Rigpa and the pranic energies" is correct, I believe, just so long as we understand that correlation is NOT causation. When, as you said, dualistic mind is inactive, it is only natural that the subtle energies in the body will begin to renormalize to the natural state. Certainly in my own case, this is true. However, this is not an instantaneous event. The energetic changes begin and then take some time (minutes) to complete. But Rigpa is "open eyes" immediate. It does not arise due to causes, and it does not in itself produce any causal effects or suffer from conditioned genesis. The cessation of dualistic mind is what produces the effects. Rigpa is what, metaphorically speaking, "blows your mind." (Nirvana is the "blowing out" of just that.)

All in all, Ryan, what you reporting here seems perfectly normal and natural. All sorts of interesting things arise as part of this process, usually associated with specific stages of development. If you are carefully noticing what is happening, you are doing it right, and you will continue to make progress through the various strata of mind.

Keep up the good work!

Kenneth

"Hi Ryan,

Focus on the fluttering of the eyelids. Is it continuous? Do the flutters come in waves? Incline your mind toward the ending of each wave of fluttering. What happens when the flutters stop?

Kenneth"

Hi, Kenneth

Nice to hear from you! : ) Thanks for the questions and encouraging words.

As for the fluttering, it comes in waves. Each wave lasts for about 8-10 seconds. Seems like my eyes are opening slightly when it happens, because there's a strobing light throughout the flutters that is its most prominent quality at this point.

Also, thanks, Jackson, for the Kornfield quote!! In fact, what's really the most prominent quality is a dull pain in my eyes, which I'm definitely averse to in the moment. In that vein for a second, I've been noticing I hold a lot of tension in my lower back. Any suggestions about how to release that tension? I think I need a more pliable cushion. The one I have might be too firm. I've also noticed holding a lot of tension in my left jaw. This morning I saw rapture arise in that area quite a lot, seeming to move from under my left cheekbone back behind my left ear, then down my left jaw and then up towards my cranium on that same left side. (It's not that the rapture sensations are some "thing" actually moving, but my attention moves as the sensations arise separately at different points.) Came in waves, as usual, but this time I noticed it more acutely in those areas of my face/head. Also in my left arm and spreading out both thighs towards my knees.

Cont. below.

Back to the flutters, they moved much more slowly this morning. Made attempts to pay attention to the end of each wave, but I think I was trying too hard. Also still getting used to the painful aspect of the sensations, so I ought be able to focus on them better -- and see the end of each wave more clearly -- once I can really let them happen and not on some level want them to go away (a la Jack Kornfield's arm flapping). : ) What I have noticed about the end of the flutters is that a feeling of calm permeates my whole body once they've subsided.

On a similar note, lately I've also noticed a slight, pleasurable rocking or rotating sensation of my spine and skull (like a hula-hoop motion). Similar stuff happening in my throat, as well. Probably similar energy stuff (like Jack says, neither enlightening nor harmful).

Thanks, everyone!

Ryan

Hi Ryan,

Your description of the bliss that follows after the fluttering subsides makes sense to me. Simply put, you're going through a bit of energetic development, which is a totally natural aspect of the practice that most (if not all) encounter at some point.

Don't worry too much about finding a way to make them stop. I don't know if getting a more pliable cushion will help. It seems to me that the irritating activity will stop once the energetic pathways have been routed out. It takes time, but I'm pretty sure it will subside as you continue to practice. It's just matter of time.

As far as releasing tension in an intentional way, try simply infusing the experience of tension with mindfulness and equanimity. Relax into it while paying attention in an open and inclusive way. The blockages will break up in time, and the physio-energetic circuitry will become more and more integrated.

Keep us posted! Since this is something that so many people experience, it would be good to chronicle your experiences in this thread so others may learn from it.

Practice well,
~Jackson

"Hi Ryan,

Your description of the bliss that follows after the fluttering subsides makes sense to me. Simply put, you're going through a bit of energetic development, which is a totally natural aspect of the practice that most (if not all) encounter at some point.

Don't worry too much about finding a way to make them stop. I don't know if getting a more pliable cushion will help. It seems to me that the irritating activity will stop once the energetic pathways have been routed out. It takes time, but I'm pretty sure it will subside as you continue to practice. It's just matter of time.

As far as releasing tension in an intentional way, try simply infusing the experience of tension with mindfulness and equanimity. Relax into it while paying attention in an open and inclusive way. The blockages will break up in time, and the physio-energetic circuitry will become more and more integrated.

Keep us posted! Since this is something that so many people experience, it would be good to chronicle your experiences in this thread so others may learn from it.

Practice well,
~Jackson"

Hello, again. My latest shift has been in my attitude towards my attitudes about all of this. Seriously, though. Meditation shoves my preferences right in their own faces. Bias might baloon as big as it can get, but it never stays still. One moment "I don't like" the pain in my spine, then I stay with it and find equanimity in knowing it, then often soon after "I like" the sensations there and want them to stay. Of course they don't, and then the whole thing repeats itself. I've found recently that I've always had a subtle assumption that my preferences were "running the show," and that success in getting what I wanted was something to be proud of. In fact, success is neither a proud moment nor a shameful moment, it merely happens, due to causes and conditions.

Practice/life today has a very different quality, and I think it has to do with the energy flow I've been describing in this thread.

Today I have LOTS of energy, and a sense of sharp, clear, ferocity akin to what the Tibetans call wrath (and I've heard of some in the Thai Forest tradition - Ajahn Chah - manifesting this as well). No situation has called upon me to fully embody this sense, but privately in practice it feels like I'm a tiger on the prowl, stalking ******** and immaturity in the wilds of my mind. No-nonsense! Spontaneous action. Along comes the whiny little clinging creature, and suddenly *POUNCE* gobbled up by the jaws of discernment. First I'm the mouse...looks cute....NO! Eagle. Mouse in its talons. Not cute!

Significantly, humility and reverence and discipline are VERY easy to transition to from this place. It's not even a transition really, but a different flavor of the same stance. No cloying genuflection. BIG thanks.

Ryan

I just sat for a half hour, ten minutes devoted to the hand-motion exercise I described before, and twenty devoted to abdomen (as insructed by my teacher in the Vipassana Dhura Dhamma Friend Program -- check it out online, if you're interested). First flutters arose, along with rapture and bliss arising together, strongly and in quick succession. Flutters again lasted approximately 10 seconds in each wave. Happening very fast and accompanied by a sense of waves moving across my eyelids, like the band in a TV set that moves top to bottom of a screen in a loop, over and over. Then that was over within the first minute or two of sitting.

Cont. below

Then soon afterward, energy flowed through my spine up to my head and neck, and suddenly my head and neck were moving in loops and dips and bends, at times pulling my head all the way down to resting beneath my knees, sitting there and moving slightly but not very slowly, like a cobra snake in smooth but winding loops, and then I would either make an intent move to raise my head and spine back to upright position, or I would watch the energy move my head and spine back up, and then this would happen again, jerking my head up (not painfully, though, just forcefully), so that I sat with my head up and mouth open and then it would slowly wind itself back, or move off to the left or to the right, or merely sit relatively "normally" with my head moving slightly. This was basically the whole 20 minutes. Began energizing, but then by the end I felt exhausted, noticed a strong desire for it to end, a slight sense of nausea in my stomach (hard to tell if this was insight-related, though, my digestive system has been a little funky lately with all the Thanksgiving meals), and then a sense of relief and laughter-like exhalation came after the exhaustion and mild misery and nausea. Then returned to the movements, which continued for the rest of the sitting period. It seemed important to 1) just notice and let it do its thing, keeping mindfulness on the abdomen throughout, and 2) have a sense of patient endurance when the process was tiresome or disorienting, and 3) have a sense of grateful acceptance, when the process was refreshing and healing. At times this felt like being run through the washing machine, and at times it felt like the most gentle and loving care. Important not to miss (or cling to) the latter. I'm left with a great appreciation for tenderness and gentleness and kindness....with that hungry tiger still lurking in the background, ready to pounce. : )

(see earlier post from today for tiger reference)

Metta,
Ryan

Hello, everyone. Another update on where I'm at these days. I hope the previous posts have been valuable to some (assuming they're not valuable to all). Please know that I'm happy to answer questions about the sorts of things I've been experiencing. Lately, the content of that has been fairly low-intensity. Flutters arise every now and then, but often not in formal sitting practice, rather when I'm taking a break from everyday tasks and resting for a moment. I've been taking a look lately at what exactly I'm doing in the present moment that leads to the sense of bliss or ease I mentioned before. It seems that the cause of that bliss or ease is acceptance. This is not acceptance in the sense of resignation or denial of power, rather it's a very deliberate choice to use powers of concentration to allow this process to unfold. In other words, for those who relate to Buddhist jargon, the present karma I'm inputing now is acceptance of the effects of past karma. Now, of course, the effects can be pleasant, they can be unpleasant, but the important point is that the effects are on their way no matter what I do now. The causes are already put into place, for better or worse. And if I begin to see that clinging to the effects creates more karma, then I can start to see where the good and the bad interrelate, how they follow each other. Then, even though I see how acceptance of fluttering (or whatever) leads to bliss, I can also see how clinging to bliss leads to a cramped leg, or something like that. In other words, if I'm not careful, I can do things well and reap the benefits, then do the benefits poorly and suffer more. Acceptance releases pain and produces pleasure, but then this pleasure is a tremendous opportunity to create more suffering in the future. In other words, I'm seeing how all rewards are nasty traps. No safe abiding anywhere. No abiding anywhere, no danger.

"In other words, I'm seeing how all rewards are nasty traps. No safe abiding anywhere. No abiding anywhere, no danger. "

Just to clarify: I mean this in a phenomenological sense. Meditation-wise. In terms of sensations. Not in the sense of conventional safety in daily life. Think of attention like a traveler who passes through a foreign country (fluttering) to a familiar one (bliss), and maybe then onto another (pain in the leg), but doesn't pitch a tent anywhere, instead keeps moving, until it becomes clear that in fact traveling is safe and happy (whatever arises is merely known. Bare knowing seems to preclude clinging, in fact.). To bring this back to more familiar language, I'm finding that taking refuge in the Dharma really works. When I simply know what is, phenomena truly don't last, they aren't governed by any entity, and they don't satisfy. And the last one is less and less of a problem, because with no entity to be satisfied, there's no craving to be satisfied.

Ok, so it's been a little while since I last posted, but I'll do a little recap of the past few weeks.

For those who like maps, I think I saw movement from the A&P (marked by this energy stuff, fluttering) through the Dark Night (lots of dispassion and weariness), on into Equanimity (the "task" of meditation simplified into knowing - as I wrote in my last post).

Now, I still notice fluttering, and in fact I'm able to call it up at will (for instance, I read Kenneth's post above, and tried out his instructions immediately thereafter). I also still notice dispassion, weariness, despair, etc. Maybe this is re-observation, and not equanimity?

In any event, the latest news to report is that, as far as I can tell, paying attention is an act of love.

Can anyone relate to that? I'm happy to clarify, upon request.

Best,
Ryan

I'd like to hear the more detailed version of "paying attention is an act of love," Ryguy913.

"
I'd like to hear the more detailed version of "paying attention is an act of love," Ryguy913."

Hmm. This detailed version of mine below may be (linguistic) bullsh*t. See for yourself.

---

Chris, the best way I can describe it is that when I give my full and complete attention to anything (and I do mean anything: friend, parent, stranger, co-worker, dog, pain in my side, gum on the sidewalk, smell of cigarette smoke, smell of dogdoo, taste of chocolate, taste of bread), I notice that this has the same feeling tone as what I consider love. Open acceptance, warm regard, courageous vulnerability, and fierce loyalty. These are not different from concentration, not different from mindfulness. Truly loving (and I don't mean a person only here) requires and bears the fruit of all of the Brahma Viharas, it requires and bestows generosity, it requires and bestows skillful restraint, it requires and bestows concentration and insight wisdom. Maybe others will not agree with my definition of love, but the way I see it, all the factors of the path are acts of love.

Cont. below

Edited for clarification of referents.

Cont. from above.

But wait, you say, all compounded things are impermanent, not-self and suffering! Exactly. That's how one can be loving. That's why one is inspired to be loving. To see those truths is the result of love. And the way one acts upon the realization of these truths is loving. When I see that nothing in this world satisfies, I am filled with love (dispassionate equanimity) - and I pay attention to the passing away. When I consider how there's nobody 'running the show,' I feel love (what might be called compassion) to all that is in the midst of the ceaseless, empty flow that we call "life" or a "person" - and I pay attention to the middle, and when I see how all of this is impermanent, I feel love (sincere gratitude) for the way impermanence hints beyond itself - and pay attention to the arising.

Please, challenge this view, if you like. To me, it is verifiable. Just notice what's actually happening in what we call love, in what we call paying attention.

Ok. I don't think I can be trusted not to talk out of my as* right now.

I mean, please feel free to comment on what I've written thus far (especially Chris -- I responded last night with a detailed version of "paying attention is an act of love" on the previous page), but I think I'm going to shut down my contributions for a little while.

Peace!

Ryan

HI, Ryan. I can't challenge your view because I completely agree with it! I knew what you were talking about. Selfishly, I wanted you to say it and not just hint at it. And you are exactly right to trust what you're feeling and experiencing yourself. That is the coolest thing. Ever. I look around on message boards for that kind of thing because that's where the real gold is.

"
HI, Ryan. I can't challenge your view because I completely agree with it! I knew what you were talking about. Selfishly, I wanted you to say it and not just hint at it. And you are exactly right to trust what you're feeling and experiencing yourself. That is the coolest thing. Ever. I look around on message boards for that kind of thing because that's where the real gold is.

"

Hi, Chris. Though I didn't respond, I appreciated what you wrote quite a lot.

I do know my earlier comments had at least a touch of BS in them, though, so taking time off from posting has been a good idea.

BUT the basics of it (similarity in feeling tone between what I experience as love and giving full attention) still ring true in the experience of the moment (i.e. as I'm typing now). The conventional life experiences that were presenting love so forcefully have changed a lot in the past few weeks -- ha! ; ) big surprise -- but the lessons learned remain valid.

I had some really intense A&P/Dark Night in the days after Christmas, so acceptance was really put to quite a test! It was quite a challenge to trust, as you put it, the actual feelings and experiences ( in this case, sensations vanishing, like a candle going out, in my solar plexus region), aside from all the thought and stuff that was going on afterward (fear of death, thoughts of attainment). Of course, those fears and thoughts were always doing what the other sensations had done -- vanishing! -- though unfortunately I wasn't able to see them in the same way.

Anyways, again thanks very much for your reply.

I missed this thread the first go around, but am really intrigued by this hand-motion thing. My question is: are the eyes open or closed during this exercise or, more precisely, is it more effective with eyes closed vs. open?

"I missed this thread the first go around, but am really intrigued by this hand-motion thing. My question is: are the eyes open or closed during this exercise or, more precisely, is it more effective with eyes closed vs. open?"

Hello, tomotvos!

I do the exercise with eyes closed, as I find this helps me to watch the hand-motions by knowing the sensations, rather than following them visually.

Here's a link to the instructions, from the website of the program I've been practicing (Mahasi-style Vipassana, with Cynthia Thatcher).

www.vipassanadhura.com/howto.htm#p

Here is a link for the video clip of the hand motions A exercise:

www.screencast.com/users/alonsovid/folde...99-bcb1-fb7c906ef44b

Hope that helps!

Ryan