n8sense's practice notes

""...Syagyi U Ba Khin used to tell his students to centre their entire attention there [edit: at the chest/heart]. Most of my meditative adventures occurred at the heart....but also at times at the solar plexus and the throat.


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Yeah - that whole region right now seems to be one "glob" to me. All of the sensations I speak about concerning this area seem to have a common center in the heart region, but the throat and solar plexus seem to be inextricably involved as well, whatever that might mean.

Hi n8sense,

Now after having gotten at least 1st path, I am totally aware of what is going on in the body. There is somehow a relationship between the chakras and our emotions. It seems that sensations of all sorts, negative and positive flow at these chakra points and the mind reacts to them. For example for me, passion was always felt at the heart as a flow of intense sexual desire and the mental reactions would obviously be thoughts on sex. Depression also seemed to come from there. Worry seemed to come from the throat. But at times I couldn't really tell which emotion came from which point.

And these chakras seem linked to the insight cycles. There is an upward movement most of the time, but as of late sometimes it jumps around so i am not 100 percent sure. What I mean is there seems to be an order to what you will feel, again not 100 percent sure. In most of my sits over the years I would get intense negative sensations at the solar plexus. Once these dissipated there then would be sensations at the chest/heart, then when they also dissipated it would move up to the throat stay for some time then dissipate and I would get those bubble burps or little escapes of air that would come out as a small burp...and then now that I remember it, I would get so much pressure between the eyes and my nose felt like it would explode and was tender to touch then maybe a mass of pressure at the top of the head which would give me the most annoying headaches. When it gets to this point nowdays, I feel the mind shift into equanimity of formations stage then onto fruition (sometimes). But before 1st path and it would go down again after that. And for me it now seems lthat is when I was going back into the dukkha nanas, as all the negative crap started flowing from the lower chakras again.

continued from above

I never saw nor realized that order back then but now it makes so much sense because that is what I experience so clearly now. These days however, the cycle seems to go up and down and there is no fruition for days. It gets a bit confusing and you can't really map what's going on. Cycles within cycles.

This all, for me, points to Kenneth's physio-energetic model. There seems to be a cleaning process of the chakras as whatever it is, maybe "kundalini" energy, makes a path up the spine and clears a road for the energy to flow without hinderance. That is what it seems to be for me. And I think this is all set off by going through the AP stage. So this process happens for anyone who may not have gotten to 1st path yet and is sped up and made automatic for someone who has. Either way, I would work with those sensations at the heart only because that is what I did and I think I did a lot of good work over the past 9 years for it.

Any thoughts?

"...I would get intense negative sensations at the solar plexus. Once these dissipated there then would be sensations at the chest/heart, then when they also dissipated it would move up to the throat stay for some time then dissipate and I would get those bubble burps or little escapes of air that would come out as a small burp...

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Hi Nikolai,

Thanks so much for your input. As I read your posts I had a strong sense of deja vu; I went over to the DhO site and found this post of mine from a year ago: bit.ly/cwBnTT

We certainly seem to have shared similar experiences. Here's an exerpt from one of my posts on that thread: "...the sensation I described as feeling like a burp bubbling its way up now seems to morph into something like a stream of small, hard, oval objects on (like those small, polished river rocks if that makes sense) working their way up the neck (this is going to sound really nuts) into my mouth, up through the roof and into my head..."

This phenomena is very familiar (if somewhat irritating) to me now - like an old, cranky friend. I'm just going to keep watching it and letting it do its thing whenever it demands attention. I am curious as to what it might be.

Today I've felt like I am developing a severe cold or the flu, which makes meditation both challenging and interesting. It's a whole different ball of wax watching the sensations of an illness from the meditative perspective. Who knew a cold could be so interesting?

I think I'm beginning to "get" what Kenneth and others talk about when they advise us to place attention lightly on the object of awareness - like holding your finger on a peanut floating in water. I tried this today and it seemed to produce a whole new level of sensations - more subtle and harder to detect than the gross sensations such as cramps, itches, etc. When I backed off of such an object and really tried to see the things I had been missing, a whole new level of sensations rose up.

Best to all,

John

Bingo. Holding things lightly is the whole deal, the real deal. Holding things too tightly almost forces you into the subject-object duality we're trying to examine from a more universal/non-dual perspective.

Nice work, John.

Thanks, Chris,

You've been such a great example and inspiration for me - reading your journals....well, let's just say they're a bit above my level of experience, yet I find them facinating and encouraging. Keep up the good work!

Well, nothing really exciting, uplifting or "sexy" to report. The past week or so has been surrealistic from a meditative standpoint. I sit down with the intent to practice X technique, but I can't develop any momentum. Instead I seem to be drawn to Y technique; when I finally give in and switch to Y, I feel like I make a little bit of progress.

Off the mat, it's like I am going through some sort of life review. Thoughts from my past come barrelling in at the oddest of times; an oldie comes on the radio and a sense of sadness and nostalgia washes over me. I remember and re-live moments from my life that...well...let's just say they don't portray "me" in the best of lights. I can't think of any good reason why this is happening - like I said, it's very surrealistic.

I mentioned that the sensations in my chest area have become very insistent that I pay attention to them lately. Yesterday, after talking with Kenneth I decided to watch these sensations and just catagorize each one as it arose as being either pleasant, unpleasant, or neutral in feeling tone. I was surprised to see that in some cases the sensations themselves were not unpleasant...some were actually pleasant. What was unpleasant was my desire to get past this block of sensations that has been haunting me for more than a year now.

Today, as I meditated and tried to watch them with equanimity, I felt the energy inside my chest begin to build. Throughout the day it has continued to build in strength. Moments ago I felt like a fighter jet sitting on the runway, engines revved as high as they can go without exploding, waiting for clearance from the tower to take off. The clearance never came and the energy has subsided again for the most part. I feel hot and my face becomes flushed - it feels like I have a high fever.

This just might be the strangest week of meditation I have experienced yet...

I continue my investigation of the chest sensations. Today as each new wave presented I quickly took measure of the initial gross impressions and then began breaking them down into finer and finer detail. Most of what presented today haves been very harsh, unpleasant energy flows that break into tiny pulses that are sort of hammering away, staccato-like throughout the chest area.

I've also been trying to remember to ask "Who am I" as often as possible throughout the day. Sometimes I feel like I can perceive this "I", but most times it has been very elusive and hard to find. I suppose with practice I'll get better at this.

I'm really dark-nighting it today and really for the past several days, I understand firsthand the urge to just roll up the mat/

I focused on asking "Who am I" most of the day while off the mat. I still have a difficult time locating and holding on to the perception of "me" or "I". It does seem to be getting easier. I noticed that I sometimes have aversive feelings when I ask this question, like I really don't want to know the answer deep down.

This afternoon's sitting focused on just letting go and surrendering to whatever "is". The heart region sensations continue to take center stage but the intensity seems to have lessened somewhat. I really tried to let go of desire, longing, etc. and was mostly successful - but at the finest level of sensations I seem to want to hang on somewhat.

Things have lightened up a bit over the past few days, though I still see myself cycling through the stages from the dark night up to equanimity and back again....and again....ad nauseum. At least in equanimity I can look at the situation with acceptance, and even a sense of humor (which is always helpful in just about any situation from my POV!).

The base of my practice continues to be a bit of concentration to start followed by vipassana/just sitting during the a.m. sittings and working on developing the 2nd Gear tools in the afternoon. I am also incorporating some new practices (new for me at any rate) suggested by Kenneth that are very helpful and I am beginning to see results from these as well - all very encouraging to me.

As I said to Kenneth recently - some sittings are more pleasurable, or feel more "productive" than others, but I've come to the realization that regardless of how I feel about each one, they are all beneficial in some way.

"Consistency, not heroics."

Best to all,

John

My practice continues as previously described. Lately I've noticed that I'm experiencing finer and more subtle layers of the stuff that make up phenomena. For example, I previously noted that a cramp in the leg was not just one solid object, but was in fact a cluster of many objects localized in the same general area such as burning sensations, contractions, etc. Lately I've been able to breakdown the make up of these objects as well - it's truly begining to feel like peeling an onion.

Kenneth's posting on the Practice Tips thread regarding the feminine approach to practice struck home for me - I guess I've been trying to get in touch with my feminine side lately without even knowing it

For the last several months I have made an effort to extend my practice beyond the cushion and integrate it as much as possible in my daily life. With Kenneth's good guidance, I've learned to be more aware of mind states, feeling tone, and arising thoughts (e.g. image thoughts, planning thoughts, ought-to-be-doing thoughts, shouldn't-be-doing thoughts, etc. as I make my passage through each day and I am trying to increase my consistency in noticing them as often as possible. It took me a while to figure out that every experience is an opportunity to practice, you don't have to be on a cushion to do this stuff.

For example, my wife and I were traveling with our grandchild recently. Lately wheneverI drive I try and use the time for second gear practice, but on this occasion I was noting mind states as we drove along. Every time my wife or grandchild would make a comment or do something to distract me, I would note the resulting state as it arose such as annoyed, amused, confused, angry, etc. If we passed a place of particular beauty, or another driver did something to anger meI noted the accompanying mind state. It's amazing how many different ones I experience in an hour's drive!

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By objectifying all of these thougts and feelings, it is becoming more and more clear that they aren't "me". Good stuff!

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By objectifying all of these thougts and feelings, it is becoming more and more clear that they aren't "me". Good stuff!"

In interest of the experience related here, did you notice or was there anything to notice between between one mind state and the next?

Hi garyh,

Good question! Sometimes it seems like there is no gap between one mind state and the next, other times it's more like a neutral or absence of any particular state, and I find myself "scanning" or "searching" for what is going on that I may be missing - or just looking out for what comes next.

"Hi garyh,

Good question! Sometimes it seems like there is no gap between one mind state and the next, other times it's more like a neutral or absence of any particular state, and I find myself "scanning" or "searching" for what is going on that I may be missing - or just looking out for what comes next."

My experience is noticing this neutral or absence when it arises leads to being able to more easily direct attention there. I have conceptualised this as the simplist me beause it seems to be just the bare sense of being, although I do not know if this definition will hold up under the scrutiny of experienced yogi's. I find noticing the state has a grounding effect and can be nudge into other interesting states.

[edit] - not that we should get too interested in mind states .

garyh: "[edit] - not that we should get too interested in mind states ."

I hear ya, bro....lol! Although, sometimes I think with all the hard work we do in our practice, we deserve a little "candy" every once in a while

But thanks for the tip - I'll pay extra attention next time I experience that neutrality. Sounds very interesting!

I thought I had better write an update while I have a moment; my life has been a bit chaotic (to say the least) these last few weeks and my practice has slowed down much more than I am happy with. I practice whenever I can, which is usually in the car as I travel to various locations to complete chores, etc. Mostly noting sensations, feeling tone, and "See how it sits...." kinds of things. Nothing new or exciting has evolved from that -- no big surprise there, but at least I feel that by doing something whenever I can, I won't slide too far backwards in my practice.

Formal sittings, when I can work them in have focused primarily on first gear.

Good to hear your still practicing, best wishes...

Clayton