Another Sitting Journal
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 8 months ago #56601
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
Hey all,
This morning I did my sitting. It was hard to notice any dissolution. I got some access concentration noticing arising and passing, then anger (unpleasant) then anxiety (unpleasant than eventually nutral) then I moved through a hazy period. Eventually I told myself--Well now is the time where we just accept everything and keep going. So I moved into a low equanimity like state. A few times my mind wandered then I immediately pulled it back. I generally combine the Goenka style body scanning with noting sensations. Usually focused on the area I am scanning although I will take a slight detour if their is something glaring. My tendency is to note less and just feel more. Which I generally feel is less productive than extensive noting. But it is what it is. I can't figure out why I haven't delved into concentration practice. I know how pleasant they can be. I guess its just I am so used to doing what I am doing. Its just like brushing my teeth or taking a shower, it would feel weird to change it. (but don't worry Kenneth I see the need, I will begin concentration practice)
This morning I did my sitting. It was hard to notice any dissolution. I got some access concentration noticing arising and passing, then anger (unpleasant) then anxiety (unpleasant than eventually nutral) then I moved through a hazy period. Eventually I told myself--Well now is the time where we just accept everything and keep going. So I moved into a low equanimity like state. A few times my mind wandered then I immediately pulled it back. I generally combine the Goenka style body scanning with noting sensations. Usually focused on the area I am scanning although I will take a slight detour if their is something glaring. My tendency is to note less and just feel more. Which I generally feel is less productive than extensive noting. But it is what it is. I can't figure out why I haven't delved into concentration practice. I know how pleasant they can be. I guess its just I am so used to doing what I am doing. Its just like brushing my teeth or taking a shower, it would feel weird to change it. (but don't worry Kenneth I see the need, I will begin concentration practice)
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 8 months ago #56602
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
I sat down this evening and while noting immediately recognized Dukka. It hung around for about 10 minutes (fear, unsatisfaction, misery) Then I turned to search for impermanence. A little easier to deal with. After that I moved into sort of a low equanimity. I don't feel like I am cycling fast anymore. I am fairly convinced that I am in a New Cycle and if I had to guess I would say I am at 3 Characteristics... At least that what my meditation the last couple days reminds me of most. I was worried about starting a new cycle but its just a natural process. I feel like always the best thing to do is relaxed, non manipulating mindfulness... May everyone have a great practice today...
Clayton
Clayton
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 8 months ago #56603
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
Good sitting tonight. Seems to be very reminiscent of 3 C territory. The inter-relationship between the three characteristics seems to be pulling closer into focus. Its difficult to explain but I am sure many on this forum know what I am talking about. Sorry need to be more diligent recording particular sensation and not general impressions. I am really coming to grips with wherever I am right now in my practice, because I feel somehow that no matter what as long as I stick with it, its all growth...
Metta,
Clayton
Metta,
Clayton
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 8 months ago #56604
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
Another challenging sitting this morning. 3 Characteristics presenting themselves for inspection. For the first time almost instinctively (without really thinking about Kenneth's instructions) I started observing the three characteristics evident in the witness. Wow. Powerful. I still felt like I was in the boxing ring during my sitting, hard to keep posture, unpleasant memories, physical weakness. But hey its all good Its not really skillful for me to wish to be somewhere else... I downloaded a program that brings up a verse from the dhammapada every time I start my computer. This one really seemed appropriate today...
Though one may know
much about Dhamma,
if one does not live accordingly -
like a cowherd
who covets another's cattle -
one experiences none of the benefits
of walking the Way.
Though one may know
much about Dhamma,
if one does not live accordingly -
like a cowherd
who covets another's cattle -
one experiences none of the benefits
of walking the Way.
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 8 months ago #56605
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
Been a bit down during waking life lately. Sat down this evening it occurred to me, indulge in some pure concentration practice. What a treat haha. Started out a bit out of my element'¦ thoughts a bit scattered. Following the breath. Coming back to the breath. Then started to calm down and feel unpleasant periphery elements start to unwind/dissolve'¦ then mild raptures on the skin for a few seconds. After that I calmed down felt a strong peace. For some reason it reminded me of being behind a really slow waterfall/ some lost innocent moment of youth. Soon I found myself in territory recalling equanimity'¦ *sorry Kenneth I am not used to reports on samadhi practice hard for me to get clearer*
I signed up to go on a Goenka retreat in late may this year after my semester finishes. Should be good to get so much continues practice in.
I signed up to go on a Goenka retreat in late may this year after my semester finishes. Should be good to get so much continues practice in.
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 8 months ago #56606
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
Sitting this morning practicing concentration again. It becomes clearer and clearer to me that I need to get this stuff down if I want a healthy tool to deal with future dark nights etc. So I sat down, got concentrated a little faster than last time. Following breath. Some of the grosser distractions started falling away. Kind of like a low equanimity. Then I found it hard to focus for a few minutes, I remembered chicken herding... I directed my attention to the entire breath instead of just the nose. After that I felt like I shifted into a solid high equanimity with occasional very subtle moments of joy and overall contentment. Then I felt like I was shifting up to my head mostly. The Body started feeling more transparent/invisible/lighter hard to explain although this only lasted for a minute or two then back down to high equanimity...
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 8 months ago #56607
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
Samadhi Practice. Getting concentrated quicker. 1st jhana pretty clear. Rapture etc. 2nd I didn't notice so much. Then third wast starting to really let of feelings of bliss (could have been 2nd) then Equanimity which I believe is the 4th jhana. I tried to advert to the 5th jhana since I had never cultivated it intentionally. I imagined infinite space. After a few minutes I felt like the boundaries of my body just released and I fell into a significantly concentrated state... didn't last too long and I went back down to a harder feeling of equanimity... enjoying this phase of practice...
I feel to use Kenneth's analogy that I am tuning the radio stations in AM, hopefully with continued practice it will be FM, CD, then Digital Surround Sound
I feel to use Kenneth's analogy that I am tuning the radio stations in AM, hopefully with continued practice it will be FM, CD, then Digital Surround Sound
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 8 months ago #56608
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
Tried Samadhi practice this morning. Adverted to the first Jhana but wasn't able to enter it. There were a lot of people in my house and renovation was going on in the next apartment so who ya gonna call?? Insight Practice. Noted away. Even though a lot of the stuff coming up was negative its all good. Have a good day practicing all...
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 8 months ago #56609
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
So more Samadhi this morning. It was cool playing around with resolutions. I didn't like them in my review stage e.g. resolve to experience fruition. But in this practice they seem to have worked well. I resolved to sit for 30 minutes. I looked up afterward bam! it had been exactly 30 minutes-- cool huh? well its the simple things people lol... I Though about what Kenneth had written about the four material Jhana so so
1. Subtle Exhilaration, Deep Joy, Chilled out, Equanimity
2. Deep Joy, Chilled out, Equanimity
3. Chilled out. Equanimity
4. Equanimity
Keeping this in mind I resolved to explore the 4 material jhanas. I adverted to the 1st one entered it repeat up till 4. I tried to cultivate 5 but it didn't happen this time. So I went back down through the jhanas. Then it occured to me... didn't Kenneth teach everyone to rise up and down these things... duh... haha so I went back up and down the arch. Wow that second time through was a lot deeper. I know understand the point of riding the arch. Today is a good day to Practice... May everyone enjoy the pure dhamma...
Clayton
1. Subtle Exhilaration, Deep Joy, Chilled out, Equanimity
2. Deep Joy, Chilled out, Equanimity
3. Chilled out. Equanimity
4. Equanimity
Keeping this in mind I resolved to explore the 4 material jhanas. I adverted to the 1st one entered it repeat up till 4. I tried to cultivate 5 but it didn't happen this time. So I went back down through the jhanas. Then it occured to me... didn't Kenneth teach everyone to rise up and down these things... duh... haha so I went back up and down the arch. Wow that second time through was a lot deeper. I know understand the point of riding the arch. Today is a good day to Practice... May everyone enjoy the pure dhamma...
Clayton
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 8 months ago #56610
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
Still doing concentration practice. Its weird how my natural inclination is to start dis-embedding from phenomenon even while practicing concentration. So the material Jhanas are getting clearer and clearer, As I move up and down the arch. I can start to feel my mind being more and more familiar so that when I am in 3rd jhana the mind 'sees' 4th and grabs onto it. I would like to master the 4 immaterial jhanas as well... At the very lease before I go on retreat mid may... Kind of busy at school but will have a bit of time at the end of classes before I go on retreat to explore these immaterial states. My resolution is the get at least to the Arising and Passing Event of Second Path. I think it is very doable... Well thats all for now...
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 8 months ago #56611
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
Hmm... Sat down to keep exploring samadhi practice... I got really concentrated quick but then thoughts started flying at me. Memories-unpleasant. I decided if there was this much bubling under the surface I had to take a look. So unpleasant memories, tension. Noting all the while. Even if I couldn't pinpoint the senstions name I would focus on the area then observe aversion. Then things felt much better for a few minutes... calm just with sensations coming and going. Then back into tension, aversion, ahhhh! make it stop, why... low equanimity, a bit more unpleasantness tried to sidetrack me... note it. Then finally equanimity... ahh much better.
I dunno what else to write. I am not sure what school I am transferring too next fall, finals are coming up and I am a bit stressed out. I notice my mind wanting to reach for permanent things in the future, this causes suffering even though on some deep level I know fighting this moment will always be a loosing battle.
I dunno what else to write. I am not sure what school I am transferring too next fall, finals are coming up and I am a bit stressed out. I notice my mind wanting to reach for permanent things in the future, this causes suffering even though on some deep level I know fighting this moment will always be a loosing battle.
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 8 months ago #56612
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
This evenings sitting. Of course went through normal routine practicing vipassana just look above to get the general idea. But at the end of the sitting in equanimity I changed gears a little. I have been pondering a talk/article written by Ajahn Munindo about prayer and practice. He is a traditional Theravada Monk but he said at some point he felt like it was just right to speak out, to let the heart say what it wanted. Even though we might not believe someone out there is gonna help he suggests giving it a shot. It reminds me of Kenneth talking about invoking the name of amitabha... heck i'll try anything once. So I started, "Lord Buddha, may I etc. may I be free from etc." Then I started to begin to visualize the buddha almost without thinking about it. But before the image was materialized it hit me. There is nothing to grasps for outside myself, and all of a sudden I was praying visualizing myself just as I was in the moment... sense of Buddha Nature in a very visceral way... I feel like I began to touch something blindingly pure that is just dying to awaken...
The Journey Continues...
The Journey Continues...
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 8 months ago #56613
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
Pleasant sitting this evening. I am noticing more distinct shifts between the strata of mind. When I hit Mind and Body (1st Jhana) I note a shift almost as if my consciousness exhaled after holding its breath for just a bit too long. Then Memories of the past with Cause and Effect, Tensions itching discomfort aversion unsatisfactoriness with 3C. Then another exhalation of consciousness but more subtle somehow. A&P Pleasant rapture welling in chest. Subtle but clear. Then axiety and general unpleasantness in DN... I realized I had hit anxiety then I just decided to be as equanimous as possible to avoid getting stuck. Then a small shift into Low Equanimity. Then a couple minutes later Equanimity. I almost seem to notice these as two states during most of my sittings... Or just clear distinctions
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 8 months ago #56614
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
So went through the nanas again this evening. A bit cluttery mind at times but as long as I note it I shouldn't have to worry. I still experience fruition probably twice a week on averadge. But I don't write about it anymore cause its kind of old news. You know I though (despite warnings haha) that once I got SE things would change. They have. But lately more and more I find myself feeling like a spiritual infant. Which is exciting. There is a lot of work to be done and only one man for the job... lol... In some ways I feel like my behavior is getting more and more disposed towards that of a much more innocent time. But things are bound to change next week I could feel rather jaded. As long as I objectify it, it isn't me. Man I love the practice...
- NikolaiStephenHalay
- Topic Author
15 years 8 months ago #56615
by NikolaiStephenHalay
Replied by NikolaiStephenHalay on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
"But things are bound to change next week I could feel rather jaded. As long as I objectify it, it isn't me. Man I love the practice... "
Yeh, this is what I keep in my head.....CHANGE...it's bound to change but if I keep noting the bastard then I start loving the practice. i don't know why I stopped noting after 1st path but man, I really feel like it makes everything navigable. Dark night?......Bring it on!!!!!! Woooooot!......cough! ...cough!....ahem......**secretly wishes that he hadn't said that** LOL!
Yeh, this is what I keep in my head.....CHANGE...it's bound to change but if I keep noting the bastard then I start loving the practice. i don't know why I stopped noting after 1st path but man, I really feel like it makes everything navigable. Dark night?......Bring it on!!!!!! Woooooot!......cough! ...cough!....ahem......**secretly wishes that he hadn't said that** LOL!
- awouldbehipster
- Topic Author
15 years 8 months ago #56616
by awouldbehipster
Replied by awouldbehipster on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
"So went through the nanas again this evening. A bit cluttery mind at times but as long as I note it I shouldn't have to worry. I still experience fruition probably twice a week on averadge. But I don't write about it anymore cause its kind of old news. You know I though (despite warnings haha) that once I got SE things would change. They have. But lately more and more I find myself feeling like a spiritual infant. Which is exciting. There is a lot of work to be done and only one man for the job... lol... In some ways I feel like my behavior is getting more and more disposed towards that of a much more innocent time. But things are bound to change next week I could feel rather jaded. As long as I objectify it, it isn't me. Man I love the practice... "
I remember when first path review fruitions became "old hat" (as old jazz musicians say). It's a good sign. It means that your mind is priming itself for the next go 'round.
Though there are permanent changes that come about after stream entry, one can still get stuck in certain places if their practice isn't maintained. Try not to slack off too much, and everything should continue to run like a well-oiled machine until the next Path emerges.
~Jackson
I remember when first path review fruitions became "old hat" (as old jazz musicians say). It's a good sign. It means that your mind is priming itself for the next go 'round.
Though there are permanent changes that come about after stream entry, one can still get stuck in certain places if their practice isn't maintained. Try not to slack off too much, and everything should continue to run like a well-oiled machine until the next Path emerges.
~Jackson
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 7 months ago #56617
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
Thanks Nikolai and Jackson for your responses. Jackson I searched Kenneth Folk on Google and found your blog. Looks like a good resource, thanks for taking the time to post... I am a bit curious, what was practice like for you in between first and second path? I am meditating for 30 mins in the morning and same in the evening. Pre Path I was usually going 45 mins each sitting... so I guess I have slacked off a but, but on the plus side daily mindfulness is way up... I feel that as long as I maintain my daily sitting the path will just continue to unfold. Did it help to have more self knowledge when going through the Dark Night? Is it more subtle, deeper, grosser? I dunno I read a lot of stuff about 3rd path but 2nd path seems like it gets a little less attention on here and the DHO...
Metta,
Clayton
Metta,
Clayton
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 7 months ago #56618
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
As I hang around here more and more I have become convicted of something. I am still basically only engaging in 1st gear practice. I have dabbled with 2nd gear a little but I think its time to really dig deep into this practice. I believe I will be using the Chan saying Jackson wrote about, "Who is carrying around this corpse." I will use it primarily during waking life with my eyes open. I'll report back... Best of luck to everyone's practice today...
- kennethfolk
- Topic Author
15 years 7 months ago #56619
by kennethfolk
Replied by kennethfolk on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
Hi Clayton,
"Who's carrying around this corpse" is cute, but there is a lot of scope there for unnecessary thinking. If I may, I would suggest the simple "Who am I?"
It cuts right to the chase, so it's consistent with the no-frills "just get enlightened already" approach that I advocate. It's natural to want to be entertained by the practice, but that is somewhat aside from the point. When done properly, these practices go much deeper than entertainment. If you get bored asking "who am I," then find out who is getting bored. Just keep drilling down until you get to the no-dog. Then let's talk some more about how the "stick that stirs the fire is eventually consumed by it."
Kenneth
"Who's carrying around this corpse" is cute, but there is a lot of scope there for unnecessary thinking. If I may, I would suggest the simple "Who am I?"
It cuts right to the chase, so it's consistent with the no-frills "just get enlightened already" approach that I advocate. It's natural to want to be entertained by the practice, but that is somewhat aside from the point. When done properly, these practices go much deeper than entertainment. If you get bored asking "who am I," then find out who is getting bored. Just keep drilling down until you get to the no-dog. Then let's talk some more about how the "stick that stirs the fire is eventually consumed by it."
Kenneth
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 7 months ago #56620
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
Thanks Kenneth, Keep it simple. Check. Much thanks...
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 7 months ago #56621
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
Going through 2nd gear in daily life--like peeling layers of an onion. At first I just got mindful of my bodily movements, later on my thouhts/emotions. This evening did a sitting with the question "Who am I?"
I eventually just got to some sense of an impartial observer. A Clear, Empty (I know a loaded word) observer. I was going through DN stuff but the observer didn't care. I hit equanimity but the watcher didn't care. My attention waned for a second getting embedded but the observer didn't care. Then the though what is observing the observer and more meta questions...
Kenneth your advice was spot on as always. What now? Continue to cultivate the no-dog during sitting and daily life? Is it important that I continue to formally sit 1st gear or should I concentrate on 2nd gear throughout formal sitting as well as I am just hanging out in review?
I eventually just got to some sense of an impartial observer. A Clear, Empty (I know a loaded word) observer. I was going through DN stuff but the observer didn't care. I hit equanimity but the watcher didn't care. My attention waned for a second getting embedded but the observer didn't care. Then the though what is observing the observer and more meta questions...
Kenneth your advice was spot on as always. What now? Continue to cultivate the no-dog during sitting and daily life? Is it important that I continue to formally sit 1st gear or should I concentrate on 2nd gear throughout formal sitting as well as I am just hanging out in review?
- kennethfolk
- Topic Author
15 years 7 months ago #56622
by kennethfolk
Replied by kennethfolk on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
Clayton, see if you can integrate 2nd and 1st Gear. From the perspective of the no-dog, aka the Witness, watch the jhanic arc go by during a sitting. Put the Witness in the foreground and watch the jhanas and nanas go by in the background. Try this both in formal sitting and daily life. Dwell at the eye of the storm as the changing phenomena swirl around you. Notice that the no-dog always looks the same. Eventually, even the Witness will soften, but there is no hurry. You can spend several years dwelling as the Witness and it will be time well spent.
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 7 months ago #56623
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
So I can see this integration is important. It wasn't easy, especially 3C and Dark Night... I kept getting torn between observing the witness and noting practice. Eventually I had to forget about the witness in DN and note my may through to Equanimity before bringing the witness aspect back. I also was trying real hard not to manipulate the trip through the jhanic arch. Usually I incline the mind to shift. So the hands off approach combined with the witness was challenging but overall powerful...
- NikolaiStephenHalay
- Topic Author
15 years 7 months ago #56624
by NikolaiStephenHalay
Replied by NikolaiStephenHalay on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
Hi Clayton,
I find that I am also falling back on just noting during the dark night. There is too much negativity that pulls my attention away from the witness state. I find it ideal to dwell in the witness at equanimity of formations stage and review. I have to second what you said about the hands off approach and the witness being quite powerful. Do you ever get kundalini spurts up the back when doing it?
I find that I am also falling back on just noting during the dark night. There is too much negativity that pulls my attention away from the witness state. I find it ideal to dwell in the witness at equanimity of formations stage and review. I have to second what you said about the hands off approach and the witness being quite powerful. Do you ever get kundalini spurts up the back when doing it?
- ClaytonL
- Topic Author
15 years 7 months ago #56625
by ClaytonL
Replied by ClaytonL on topic RE: Another Sitting Journal
Hey Nick,
Well I sometimes get tension in the 3rd eye area which I read you talking about. I don't get it nearly a bad as you write about. But its noticeable sometimes through out the day or during a sitting. What do you do about it? Just try to gain some equanimity about it? Oddly I dont get the spurts up the spine, I know what you are talking about but I haven't noticed it... I get pleasant energy up the spine during qi gong, but its been probably a month since I have done that...
Edit:Its not clear enough for me to be sure its not just a touch of a headache... Dunno
Well I sometimes get tension in the 3rd eye area which I read you talking about. I don't get it nearly a bad as you write about. But its noticeable sometimes through out the day or during a sitting. What do you do about it? Just try to gain some equanimity about it? Oddly I dont get the spurts up the spine, I know what you are talking about but I haven't noticed it... I get pleasant energy up the spine during qi gong, but its been probably a month since I have done that...
Edit:Its not clear enough for me to be sure its not just a touch of a headache... Dunno
