yadid's practice journal

Today I've returned from my 3.5 day retreat and it was fantastic.
I didn't get stream-entry but I think I was very close, getting to what I think is equanimity, twice.
The Sayadaw's knowledge of insight knowledges is phenomenal.

On the first day I thought I had crossed the A&P already and was in the Dukkha nyanas, since I experienced a lot of suffering, though on my interview with Sayadaw he asked me some questions which made me realize he thought I was at the first nyana, Mind and Body, but I continued practicing.
On the second day evening I decided to just note aggressively whatever what - whatever arose and was in the mind at that moment I noted, until it became very quick and my whole identity seemed to be sensations, and that was that. Crossing the A&P with noting is different and interesting.
Third day: looots of suffering and aggresive noting got me to what I think is equanimity - what I did was simply sit and note whatever was predominant in the mind, imagination, craving, thinking of future, of past, fear, etc etc.. this got extremly fast and it felt like my identity and self are being dissolved.

I then fell back and had a terrible headache.
The next day the headache continued, this was the last day and I was due to return home the same evening as my girlfriend was going to pick me up, though the schedule included meditation practice and noble silence up until the last hour! this was difficult but I decided to make good use of it and I got to what I think is equanimity again, this time more strongly established.

Again, I simply stared at my portable red kasina for a while and then started aggresively noting whatever was predominant in the mind at that moment including sensations, this got extremely fast.

What do you think?

I learned alot about moving through the nyanas on this retreat, namely that I fall back beyond first nyana at home ->>

and that I should again start maintain a strong daily practice as I used to in the past.
I'll write more later since I dont have much time at the moment,
But I'd like to really thank all of you for your advice and inspiration, it really helped!

Good work yadid!!!!

I would just keep doing what you are doing. You need to experience equanimity of formations enough times so that insight matures and becomes ripe. Like a fine red wine, you are letting it mature until you get to drink it up. When I was introduced to the nanas in the beginning of 2008, it wasn't until insight really matured 2 years later that I got stream entry. As Kenneth has said "constancy, not heroics"... as well as "steady as she goes". And as U Ba Khin said..."Keep swinging on the rope!!!!"

Mudita
Nick

"On the first day I thought I had crossed the A&P already and was in the Dukkha nyanas, since I experienced a lot of suffering, though on my interview with Sayadaw he asked me some questions which made me realize he thought I was at the first nyana, Mind and Body, but I continued practicing."-YadidB

For what it's worth, Yadid, my experience with Mahasi monks, including Sayadaw U Vivekananda, for whom I have a great deal of appreciation and respect, having spent 5 months at Panditarama in Rangoon in 1993/94 as part of one of three long Asian retreats, during which time I spoke with U Vivekananda every day, is that they always assume that you are in the 1st Insight Knowledge upon arriving at a retreat. The possibility of progress in daily life seems to be outside of their worldview.

You have to be a light unto yourself and realize that sometimes even the experts can be victims of their own preconceptions about what is and what is not possible. We are pioneering new territory here. The evidence is mounting that extraordinary progress, including the attainment of 1st, 2nd, 3rd, and even 4th Path is possible for dedicated householder yogis, in some cases with little or no retreat experience.

Enlightenment is a human thing. It does not belong to anyone. Not even Buddhist monks. You go, man. Next stop, stream entry.

Kenneth

Thanks for the reply Kenneth and Nikolai.

Kenneth, you are right, it did feel like he's not really listening to what I have to say about my previous experience and just wants to know whats going on now.
But in this case, he was indeed right, I was probably in the 3rd nyana, only to cross the A&P the next day evening when I started really getting the hang of noting.
I knew that he didn't want my analysis of where I am and only description of how my rising and falling was feeling, so I played his game.
But I didn't really like his meditation instructions - to observe the rise and fall - but he was OK with me observing the in and out breath at the nostrils, but later on I was just observing the mental processes quickly and dominant sensations.
What I really liked about this retreat is that I built a solid foundation of noting practice - when it really gets fast and furious and doubts arise, they are noted real quick and there's really no place for doubt because its just another thing arising and passing quickly.
There was expectation arising for stream-entry to occur, but that was also noted quickly and other things arose as well.
I even thought 'maybe I'm scripting this because of what Nikolai told me?" and then that doubt was noted quickly and other things continued, so I'm quite sure it was what I thought it was.

What I really liked about this monk is that he really knows his insight stages and is not afraid to tell laypeople they can get enlightened. He even said that the 2 students of his from Tel Aviv who brought him to Israel are highly enlightened.
You are right though, he gave the impression that if one wishes to get stream-entry, one must come to sit for a month or two, something I'm not planning to do. I wanna do this at home.

If I managed to go all the way from 1st nyana to 11th during such a short retreat, that really boosts my confidence

And he really likes to talk about Nibbana.. his voice gets really funny when he shouts it.
It was a nice change from the Goenka tradition where it is considerd a myth of saints and heroes.
Upon returning home I slowly became highly disoriented from all the talking and going to buy food at the supermarket and I had to go to sleep, today I feel more like myself again

So in regards to actual practice, am I doing this right Kenneth?

I started at the breath and then starting looking into the mind-stream, at first it was 'searching, imagination (visual), craving, pain, itch, searching, doubt, fear', and then it became real real fast, but I continued the noting. I experimented dropping noting when it became fast but that seemed to make it less accurate.

Back to daily practice:
I want to really do an hour or two every day to keep progressing. I've really suffered enough and I want to keep going so good things will happen to my mind today and later on.

So obviously concentration and insight are not as strong as when I left the retreat, but I certainly built a good noting foundation practice and it feels like much much better than the noting abilities I had prior to this retreat. back to Dark Night I guess?
On we go!

"In other words, you see that all of us are just little balls of conditioning walking around pretending to be important. At the same time, you feel great compassion for all of these silly creatures, yourself included, and want to care for them.

Karuna,

Kenneth"


Love this description, Kenneth.

Does anyone here who's familiar with Star Trek remember "The Trouble With Tribbles"?

Also, compassion without wisdom, that's like Gremlins.

All the stuff we read about, all of it, can be done at home. Listen to Kenneth. He knows.

I seem to be getting to the 'equanimity regarding formations' stage quite quickly during my daily sits.
Noting is genius, why didnt I try this a year ago when I first heard of it? oh well. (see how it thinks of past)

This sounds great, Yadid. Keep practicing as much as you can in the wake of your retreat to take advantage of all the momentum you have built up. And let's schedule another Skype talk.

And I agree with you: noting is genius. It's amazing that such a simple technique can be so powerful.

Kenneth

"I seem to be getting to the 'equanimity regarding formations' stage quite quickly during my daily sits.
Noting is genius, why didnt I try this a year ago when I first heard of it? oh well. (see how it thinks of past) "

Hi, Yadid. Though I know there are other resources for this sort of thing, would you be willing to describe the 'equanimity regarding formations' stage in some detail for myself and anyone else who might be interested?

Lesser side notes:

I've become very familiar with the second and third vipassana jhanas lately (according to Bill Hamilton's model, as described in MCTB), I'm really unclear about whether I'm getting into equanimity at all, or just descending back into an earlier and less sucky stage down from anywhere between the 6th to 10th nyana, depending.

Also, that line Daniel references from the Visuddhimagga about Desire for Deliverance, Re-Observation, and Equanimity being the same really intrigues me. Anyone got any insight into the meaning of that?

Hi ryguy,

So for me the equanimity stage was obvious in two ways: Since I was aware I had gone through A&P a day before on this retreat, and feeling all the dark night tension, when I became calm in face of all the mental and physical formations arising moment to moment (which were there before), and I was able to be aware of their arising and passing which is self-less in faster and faster speed, I knew this was equanimity. Falling back and getting up again (which happens on its own, you just keep doing the same practice), confirmed that.

So I guess on retreat with intense practice it is more clear, but probably over time it will become clearer in daily practice as well.

Nowadays I love noting thoughts of progress, intentions to facilitate progress, thoughts of wondering where I am on the maps at a given moment, and so on. When I catch a mental formation just as it arises and penetrate it real clear, i feel like the 'wheel of progress' spins a bit faster and gains more momentum, and I note that feeling too

"
"....when I became calm in face of all the mental and physical formations arising moment to moment (which were there before), and I was able to be aware of their arising and passing which is self-less in faster and faster speed, I knew this was equanimity....

...Nowadays I love noting thoughts of progress, intentions to facilitate progress, thoughts of wondering where I am on the maps at a given moment, and so on. When I catch a mental formation just as it arises and penetrate it real clear, i feel like the 'wheel of progress' spins a bit faster and gains more momentum, and I note that feeling too

"


Hey, Yadid. Forgive me for derailing your thread, but this is just what I was looking for. Thanks! Based on that report, I definitely have been getting to Equanimity some of the time, and I definitely have been falling back before into a grosser level than Equanimity much of the time, as well.

I think your example of what you've been noting lately is spot on for me where I'm at as well, especially that bit about the wheel of progress, how you've caught that feeling about the "aware of progress sensations," too. That is a blip I've been missing. Thanks!

- Ryan

I just read Mahasi's section on the Re-observation and Equanimity stages in the 'Progress of Insight' booklet and it really details that territory well, at least in my experience:

"If he perseveres thus, his noticing will become more and more clear as the time passes in minutes, hours, and days. Then he will overcome the painful feelings and the restlessness in being unable to remain long in one particular posture, and also the idea that his insight knowledge is not yet clear enough. His noticing will then function rapidly, and at every moment of noticing he will understand quite clearly any of the three characteristics of impermanence, etc.

When this knowledge of re-observation is mature, there will arise knowledge perceiving evident bodily and mental processes in continuous succession quite naturally, as if borne onward of itself. This is called "knowledge of equanimity about formations."

Now, in the act of noticing, effort is no longer required to keep formations before the mind or to understand them. After the completion of each single act of noticing, the object to be noticed will then appear of itself, and insight knowledge, too, will of itself notice and understand it. "

I haven't been practicing regularly in the past few days and I am not very happy with that.
Sitting for an hour this evening after a good afternoon rest, I was very focused.
Stared at the kasina for a while and started noting things as they arose.
An insight which I had and is understood in deeper ways now is that remembering states which I had before is just a memory,
I can remember how it felt to have very concentrated precise sittings in which I can watch mental processes arise and pass quickly, I can remember the freedom in that, but this is just a remembering thought
And that really relates to what Kenneth wrote about 'every moment you're making love to ideas you could be doing the practice', and practically for me that means seeing how thoughts of progress or thoughts of remembering previous states are arising and passing in this moment.
I also read the "One by One as they occurred" Sutta today and I really like how it relates to noting practice.

Ahh back on the horse.
Meditated for an hour this evening.. Stared at the kasina for like 10 minutes and then started noting. The more concentrated I get the more I notice how there are subtler and subtler layers of thoughts and mental processes.. weird things going on in this mind. Very relaxed and lots of expansiveness-type sensations going on. Equanimity? who knows..
I find that noting becomes a bit harder when pleasant states arise since my tendency is to just 'sit back and relax', so I try to 're-start the engine' as they arise.

The meditations have been going deeper today.. I'll try to describe: the mind is becoming more and more quiet (there are many things going on but it is becoming harder to objectify subtler and subtler mind objects), sensations of expansiveness, "blackness" and space, it is becoming harder and harder to note within these states but I'm doing my best.
During these sittings I felt 'close', whatever that is. I had several 'What was that?' moments, but I continued practicing and dismissed them as near-misses or something.

My sittings are going deeper. During these sittings, it is quite clear to me what I am experiencing and I'm continuing to objectify all that I can, but later, when I try to explain what I experienced, I'm left speechless or whenever I try I feel like it really does not capture anything.

Anyway, I'll try: I sat for an hour, stared at the Kasina for a while and began noting. After a while I got very concentrated and calm, the focus was more on the mental side of things, and I was trying to objectify everything that arises. After a while I felt like something is about to happen (I get this sometimes) and had several "was that it" thingies but I continued to objectify those things as well. During this sitting my focus also went to the third eye and was drawn there into a black ball which was very calm and disorienting.

Spoke to Kenneth and described my lack of words for describing my experience and he said I should write that, too.

I'm also finding that when I drop noting I'm afraid I might just solidify these calm states and not objectify them.

When I get concentrated and very mindful in sittings, the sense of self gets real slippery.
I see that everything is mind. Mind is watching mind, its weird.
After speaking with Kenneth and Nikolai I'm gonna try to stop noting when I get to these areas and see what happens.

"When I get concentrated and very mindful in sittings, the sense of self gets real slippery.
I see that everything is mind. Mind is watching mind, its weird.
After speaking with Kenneth and Nikolai I'm gonna try to stop noting when I get to these areas and see what happens.
"

Hey Yadid,

In my experience when the mind feels very slippery that was usually mid-equanimity for me. It always felt like I had a lot of vibrational activity at the brow. It was hard to concentrate and I would sometimes just get lost and space out because that is the danger when it feels slippery. You may have to develop the knack to widen your focus and take it all in as opposed to singling out phenomena with a narrower focus. I think this is when Kenneth says in his explanation of the progress of insight that the yogi has to re-learn how to concentrate. So be weary of getting embedded in that slipperiness if you stop noting. The noting is kind of necessary at mid-equanimity as it keeps you on track. When I said I stopped noting at one stage it was definitely high equanimity which for me, wasn't really slippery but dispersed. It was easier to see everything arise and pass, kind of like taking a step back and watching the whole shebang from that angle. That is when I would halt noting, at times because it felt like everything was being "noted" without the mental verbalizations. So be wary of when to "let go". Experiment!

I just read what you wrote and you said your sense of "self" gets slippery so i misunderstood. i would have to agree that it does get "slippery" at that stage as it feels so dispersed and hard to locate because you are seeing it more for what it is, impermanent, non-self phenomena. Keep the momentum going!!!!

Hi Nikolai,

When I sit down to describe my experience it is best done right after the sitting, later on (like now) it's just a strange memory.

So I'll try to describe this 'slipperyness' and maybe you can make something of it. So I sit down and concentrate on the kasina for as long as necessary (5minutes usually) to get the whole room to start vibrating and the kasina to become a black ball and disappear (hehe!). I start noting everything, body sensations, dissatisfaction, imagination, thinking, investigation, peace, and all that.. After a while I think it feels like what Daniel describes as 'tri-ality', there's mind, body, and me. more and more things are seen as part of the fluxing field. So it feels very strange, and indeed I sometimes space out.

mid-equanimity you say? what characterizes High equanimity from Mid so I can watch out for that?

Hi Yadid,

All this is from my own experience so don't take it as the gospel. It could be different for you.
Mid equanimity seems for me to be when the third eye chakra is all vibey and my concentration is all over the place, but I feel quite equanimous. It is just hard to concentrate on one thing as this is the slippery mind for me. Then the vibrations shift up to the crown and for me that is high equanimity because when that happens, the mind stops being slippery and hard to concentrate and it's like you take a step back from it all and are able to see everything arise without much hassle. Very equanimous. It is where I really feel above it all and very calm and peaceful and it isn't too hard to concentrate on a specific arising phenomena. But in mid-equanimity it is not so easy to do.
I am only speaking from my own experience so it could be different for others. Hopefully someone else will chime in with their opinion. I 'know" I am in high equanimity because of the shifiting vibrations to the crown, the mind fully disperses outwards, things are seen easily and the whole state is calm and concentration is effortless. I also have a wider focus here, taking in the whole head and upper chest.

Experiment with letting go. See what happens. It should feel quite automatic at high equanimity to let go.

Nick

Yeah, I'll just have to test it out and see.
As I said, trying to remember sits and experiences is becoming really hard for me and I just have to sit and then immediately write down the experiences, because these are weird things to have to remember.

About momentum - I dont really have that much momentum going.. I note a bit during the day when I can and I sit for an hour a day.

As I laid down to rest for a while on my sofa, I naturally began inquiring into the sense of self.
I tried pinning down the sense of self and holding on to it, if I remember correctly I felt like awareness became broad and other strange things were being felt but I cannot remember exactly. I then went into a 20 minute sleep which was very refreshing
I don't think that was the Witness but rather a Vipassana dissolution of the self but without any noting and very broad awareness.