Pejn trying to advance.

Funny thing: In the middle of the worst I reflected about magazine articles describing meditation giving you 'calmness', 'harmony' and 'bliss'.
What do they know??!!!
(Mixed with doubt that I was doing it wrong.)

Now I feel just OK, and the post seems very dramatic, but it was real then.

Tomorrow is a new day.
Goodnight /Pejn

"Funny thing: In the middle of the worst I reflected about magazine articles describing meditation giving you 'calmness', 'harmony' and 'bliss'.
What do they know??!!!
(Mixed with doubt that I was doing it wrong.)

Now I feel just OK, and the post seems very dramatic, but it was real then.

Tomorrow is a new day.
Goodnight /Pejn
"

Hi Pejn,

It seems to me that you are doing it exactly right. Welcome to the ride

Antero

Thank you Antero!

This morning:
Just an average 30 mins Gunaratana-style meditation, mixed with some loud and silent noting.
Nothing to report really. Except that I got restless after 29 mins and 40 sec (!) and quit.

/Pejn

"Except that I got restless after 29 mins and 40 sec (!) and quit.

/Pejn"

I wonder what would happen if you investigated that feeling of restlessness.

Antero.

"I wonder what would happen if you investigated that feeling of restlessness.

Antero."

Great idea Antero, since it happens so often just before the bell rings.
Welcome it and really look at it.

Have felt shivers and upward slowly "swooshing" feelings (1 rising in every 3-5 secs) inside the body today.
Normally the shivers are pleasant when they appear, but not now.
Felt almost like when I do when I am about to get sick.

Evening meditation:
Sat down and noted loud.
Could keep up for a few minutes but became too tired to continue.
Switched to samatha.
After 30 mins pain in the leg began.
So I shifted to my chair.
This was to avoid agony from the pain.

But what happened?
Instead my nose started to itch sharply! So sharp that in the end I could not sit still.
So many of the problems I had yesterday came back anyway. (But not the fear or the doubt.)
So much for trying to ecape...

I tried to investigate the restlessness as Antero suggested.
It seems to consist of some movements below the ribs, tension in shoulders and, in later stages, itching inside the body that can only be released by moving and stretching the body.
Not mental at all was my impression tonight. But it was hard to nail down. Needs more research.

Could not help but stretch the body and scratch my nose to survive, but the sharp ithes and the bodily restlessness came back anyway.
Thanks to moving I could sit until the bell rang at 60 mins (was halfway to get up, but saw the timer and sat for 54 more heroic seconds

During the whole meditation time it was hard for me to get grips on something substantial to note, everything was blurry and messy and slipped away. Even when I recognized some concentrated states, they were not pleasant and was 'hidden' by the blurriness.

Goodnight /Pejn

Morning meditation:

TM for 30 mins sitting in chair.
A bit more chaotic than normally, but went OK.

I got into concentration states two times, where I again felt the attention pull towards the breath. I really wanted to go there.
Had to force myself back to the TM technique both times.

Interesting, because in my TM-period (some 20 years ago) that never happened.
/Pejn

I had my first Skype session with Kenneth today. Thanks Kenneth!

Learned his noting technique with three foundations.
I do not have any important thoughts so we skipped the forth foundation'¦
Open eyes was a bit of a surprise.
No concentration preparation also surprise
But these two things mean that it can be done almost everywhere.

So this practice is what I will do from now?
OK, let's do it then.

First evening meditation "Kenneth style"

Sat in char. Decided to try at least 30 mins this first time.
Started to note loud with open eyes.
Noted, noted, noted'¦'¦'¦..
Bodily feelings, seing hearing, (one smell) touching.
Pleasurable non pleasurable and neutral. 'Doublets' most of the session.
Very hard to find mind states though.
Actually I believe I have no mind states. Most stuff happens in the body.
No problems doing this new technique. Probably the open eyes prevents from falling into concentration.
Became somewhat concentrated, but did not disturb noting much.
Noted, noted, noted'¦'¦'¦..
Mostly the same stuff as in a normal meditation.
No agony at all.

At 30 mins started to note unpleasurable stuff, mostly bodily.
Some restlessness and tiredness, seems connected.
Became more tired and dull.
Noted silently, no energy.
Eyes closed themself.
Stayed like this for a while, very tired.
Forced my eyes open and to note loud again.
The seeing almost dissolved into dots or pathes for a while here. (or maybe before)
Tired and restless, stiffness and tensions in neck.
Started to look at clock but noted 'restless' instead.

With a few minutes to go a shift.
Suddenly noted without effort, no restlessness, no tiredness.
Smooth feeling in body.
Some mild happy feelings. (did not note that, why?)
Could go on for longer but bell rang. 60 mins!

Afterwards good pleasant feeling, feel refreshed.

Goodnight /Pejn

Morning meditation:
Sitting on cushion:
Started note loud.
Slow start but continued all 30 mins without interruption.
Noted some more mind states than yesterday.
Noted some aversion against even neutral sensations, like "I dont want stuff to happen at all."
Noted deep tiredness and dullness for a while.
Noted some tension and some restlessness in the end.
Tried to continue noting while standing up again and preparing for leving home. Managed a few minutes.

On a ten minute walk to office i noted as well, this was harder, but I did note "fear" when I heard cars passing. Have not seen that feeling clearly before.

Overall interesting tecnique and I think it is a way to progress.

/Pejn

"
With a few minutes to go a shift.
Suddenly noted without effort, no restlessness, no tiredness.
Smooth feeling in body.
Some mild happy feelings. (did not note that, why?)
Could go on for longer but bell rang. 60 mins!

"

Hey Pejn,

Getting into some new territory here?

Your notes are great and straightforward. You can definitely see how a sit for you progresses. Keep cutting out that path!!!!



Nick

"Hey Pejn,

Getting into some new territory here?

Your notes are great and straightforward. You can definitely see how a sit for you progresses. Keep cutting out that path!!!!



Nick"

Hi Nikolai!

Maybe it is new, a few times before I have pushed myself through the agony around 50-60 mins and came out to the calmness on 'the other side' for some moments.
The phases and up&downs in KFD-style vipassana is less intensive and harder to identify than in Gunaratana-style so far, but seems to be the same.

And Thank you!
/Pejn

"
Some mild happy feelings. (did not note that, why?)
"

My own experience showed me that I would get into new territory, perhaps a calmer more peaceful state not experienced before and I would feel like just chilling out there, not making any hard pushes to keep practicing insight. The novelty of having passed through the rough spots and now finding myself in a calm place made it so I just wanted to enjoy it. Then over time as I cycled up to this calm place continuously, the novelty slowly wore off. I got bored of it. The habitual tendency of my mind to want to experience something new kicked in. Then eventually I realized (years later) that I had cut out a path up to the 11th nana. I then looked at those calmer happier experiences in a different light.


It seems like that is the case for most yogis, that they get into new territory and old mental habits kick in strong,. A yogi who gets to the AP, may have an amazingly blissful experience and get caught up in it. A yogi who gets their first taste of the dukkha nanas, may also get very caught up and identified with it. Same for the equanimity stage. If a yogi keeps at it, they break through those strong habitual tendencies to react to pleasant, unpleasant and neutral phenomena in the way that the mind habitually does and they then continue to dis-identify with the novelty-free phenomena.

So, maybe the reason you didn't note those mild, happy feelings was perhaps because the mind's strong habit is to bask and enjoy the calmness. Nothing wrong with it. Eventually it will get bored, and a yogi will be reminded that it doesn't matter if a state is pleasant, unpleasant or neutral. The big insight for me at 4th path (5th stage in Kenneth's new model), was that no phenomenon has a higher status than some other phenomenon. All sensations are of the same status regardless of tone. No preferences!

I'm now waffling. Hehe! Keep on keeping on, Pejn!!!

Get your message Nikolai. If I get calm, don't chill out, keep on working.

Friday workout in 'stair machine' at the gym.
Boring work, so I thought 'why not note'

Said and done: I noted while exercising for 25 mins. (+ 10 mins with high pulse, but that is food for another forum'¦)

Funnily enough the body sensations and feeling tones were almost like sitting. Some confusion with all the body movements, but that settled.

Now mind states, with all the women in the gym! A totally different story.

Pretty empty when just working out, but when seeing a woman walking around or exercising'¦!
Probably up to a dozen different mind states of all kinds. Mix of positive and negative.
Not very strong though, that's why I don't notice them otherwise. Thank heaven am not 16 anymore.

Next time I will try noting when spinning, more intensive pulse rate there. And less distraction

Had some fun with this image that appeared to me:
A man sitting in lotus position in the middle of the women's locker room.
Telling the staff: 'I'm just watching my mind states!'
/Pejn

Evening meditation.

First 30 mins on cushion, the switched, mindfully, to the chair for 30 mins.
Don't know exact time, forgot my timer. First time!
First 30 mins nothing special, not so easy noting this time. (Itching is good, easy to note.)

In the chair a lot of dullness and sleepiness..
Two times I 'had to' close my eyes and follow breath for maybe 5 min.
Opened eyes refreshed and less dull. But felt a bit guilty for 'failing' the advices. (Did I note that? No? Damn!)

After 50 mins very dull but pressed on.
Suddenly a wave of energy swooped up through the body and I went very clear and alert. But not as calm and smooth as yesterday.
Slowly became restless and somewhat dull again. Some aversion to sitting.
Anteris advice helped me through that a couple of times together with the attitude: 'Never mind what I feel and what happens. Just note, stupid.'
I also once broke through the feeling. 'Ok. Now I am ready and done, no use meditating anymore tonight' that have made me quit many times before. 'Come on, just note, stupid. '

The last 10 minutes I think I looped through all states over again.

Hard work this hobby.

A reflection about journaling:
There seems to be a lot of 'First time' in this one week old journal. More than I have collected for the last couple of months.

Goodnight /Pejn

"Hard work this hobby.

A reflection about journaling:
There seems to be a lot of 'First time' in this one week old journal. More than I have collected for the last couple of months."

If I was to hazard a guess from what you have just written there, it seems you passed through the first 3 nanas in the first 30 minutes. Itchiness, dullness, sleepiness all seemed to occur for me at those stages. If I kept on trooping, I would suddenly have a surge of energy up the body which shifted the mind into a clear and alert state, just like you explained. I would say this could be the 4th nana. You may have dropped back down into the 3rd nana, becoming restless and dull again or maybe you crossed into the dukkha nanas. . I really enjoy reading your notes as they are so clear and descriptive. Nice job, Peijn

Mudita,

Nick

P.S. Just wait till the "hobby" becomes your entire life......not in a "I am gonna live in a meditation centre for the rest of my life" kind of way, but "when I eat, there is eating, when i walk, there is walking, when I type, there is typing" kind of way.

Slept 10 hours tonigt. Needed that.
No morning sitting.

Walked to the store to buy some groceries.
Noted whispering on the walk, totally 1 hours 20 mins.
(All times are rough approximations. Don't look at clock much.)

Went like this now familiar pattern:

min 1-20: Quickly into good constant noting. Getting concentrated fast. Felt like finding 'insights' how I experience stuff especially when in contact with people.

min 20-30: In the store. Only short bursts of noting.

min 30-40: Went out of store, picked up noting again.

min 40-45: Fell into weary tiredness, had to close eyes a few mins. Applied Anteros device here: Noted 'tiredness'.

min 45-55: Came out of tiredness. Continued noting.

min 55-60: Clearness, calmness, easiness came. Here I felt 'done'. Like it was no use meditating more because it was, well'¦, done!

min 60-80: Now I had to apply Nikolai's advice to not chill out in the easyness.
Started noting again even if it felt unnecessary and almost like I had forgotten how to do it.
Noting was slippery now, got lost in thoughts a lot.

Came home.

An hour later did TM for 30 mins. Neat.

During the afternoon, face was warm and pulsing.

/Pejn

Evening sit:

In chair noting loud.
This time the tiredness came efter 5-10 mins
'Had to' follow breath. Energy rise and concentration shift within a few seconds.
(Interesting visual effect when the eyes turned inwards and downwards with open eyes.)
After a few minutes with closed eyes could upen them again.
Noted eyes open for the rest of the 60 min session, with a few resting moments with eyes closed.
The rest of the session had so many ups and downs in energy and states (all quite mild), that nobody could remember or make sense of it .
In the middle I had some strong face contractions that I usually got with TM in the middle of these sessions before, but not in 'modern times'.
In the end some mild sorrow and fear for a few minutes (shapes in my tapestry looked like creepy eyes'¦)

Added 10 mins bonus samatha session afterwards just for fun.

Goodnight /Pejn

No morning sit today.

Went in to the city.

Noted whispering for a short time in a shop 5-10 mins
Noted silently driving the car back home 15-20 mins.
Went well. Strong happiness feelings and a hot face while driving.
Could keep attention on traffic, no problem.
Noted silently while doing home work 10-50 mins

Evening sit:
Noted loud with open eyes.
Much like the last two evening sits. Less tiredness and developed much deeper concentration.
In the end 55-65 mins: Energy surge lead too so focused state that I after a while my closed eyes into deep concentrations with 'empty' spacious head.
Then my head turned left by itself and stayed there for a while, until I decided time was over and I had to force myself out of this state.
Could have continued longer.

Special today: 65 mins in seiza on cushion without any pain at all. Or maybe the pressure I felt really was pain but I did not care.
Interesting evening.

Goodnight /Pejn

Fell asleep late.
Was waken in the night by wife.
Half sleeping half awake I had visions.

I saw my own thoughts, like spherical bright crystals, connected to each other in a net, or a mat. Bright skining. Very beautiful and pleasant.

Could not bring myself to wake up. Stayed in the vision until I fell asleep again.
/Pejn

Morning sit:

30 mins Noting loud.
Getting used to this now
No surprises this morning.
/Pejn

Afternoon in the gym:

Noting while working out in stepping machine again.
Got lost i a TV show (scrubs) for a while. and got lost in thoughts for some short time.
Otherwise noted (and sweated) for 35 mins.

Interesting: when the calm focus came after 12-15 mins, immediately the resistance against increasing the workout intensity disappeared and I increased my pulse with from 140 to 150 without much effort.

Evening sit: Very tired, a bit dizzy.
First "meditation light" (just laying down and "looking" at sensations, adding some attention to the breath.)
15 to 20 mins. maybe.

Then sitting noting loud on cushion.
It turned into silent noting mosly.
Sat only 30 mins, need my sleep now.
Goodnight /Pejn

This morning in a hurry.
No meditation. Bad Yogi!

Noted in the slow morning traffic 10-15 mins. Worked fine.


Evening sit:
Sitting in seiza, open eyes. Noting loud.
I think I have learned to do this now.
60+ mins.
Followed the breath effortlessly for a while after bell rang.
Could have done longer.
No problem dealing with the pains. (stretched my back a little at 45 mins.)
So I have broken the 60 mins wall.
Overall calm pleasant sit with not so many ups and downs.
One moment of fear with strong cold shivers when I saw a smoke cloud moving in the window. (From a chimney.) One more less intensive fear later on. Something I saw. Don't remember what.
Like when I was a child. Almost amusing!

Goodnight /Pejn