A beginners Journal
- RevElev
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70386
by RevElev
Replied by RevElev on topic RE: A beginners Journal
Well, my world is crumbling all around me, yet I'm fine. It feels like throwing back the curtains and opening up a window in an old musty room I've been hiding in for way too long. It's beautiful outside, and I'm going.
I realize this isn't exactly meditation news, but I hope this may provide someone with motivation to continue, or start, practice. There is so much more to this then just being less stressed. It really does change how ones sees the world, and allows you to act in the best ways you can, for yourself and others.
Metta.
I realize this isn't exactly meditation news, but I hope this may provide someone with motivation to continue, or start, practice. There is so much more to this then just being less stressed. It really does change how ones sees the world, and allows you to act in the best ways you can, for yourself and others.
Metta.
- jgroove
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70387
by jgroove
Replied by jgroove on topic RE: A beginners Journal
Thanks for sharing this, Rev. These kinds of boundary issues can be tough to negotiate--but they are so much tougher to deal with when you're completely embedded in them. When you say "fear has arisen, but it's an object of attention, not me and mine," to me, that seems like the exact lesson someone would have to learn if the starting point was psychology, rather than a meditation practice based on sensate experience. It's basically--"oh, OK, this fear isn't something I have to be afraid of. I can handle it." Meditation prepared you for this step, but still it takes a lot of courage to speak the words and push the boundary back to where it belongs. Way to go!
- RevElev
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70388
by RevElev
Replied by RevElev on topic RE: A beginners Journal
I've noticed over the past week that my ability to see thoughts and emotions arise in real time, and release them before I become entangled in them, has really increased. It is a matter of noticing the tension in the body before I even know what thought or emotion it will become. I think this tension is the "vibrating" I hear about around here. I wouldn't describe it that way myself, but can see how others would.
My over all feeling is much more relaxed and open then it has been. The past month or so I've re-focused my meditation with very good results. Happiness is steadily increasing, hard for it not too when most tension is released as it arises and I return my mind to a light and open state. If I'm able to stay on top of the arising tension, everything is very pleasant. If some tension slips by my awareness and it becomes an emotion I've found an easy way to release it. I simply ask "who is angry(sad, frustrated etc.)" and the tension and emotion just drop away, like a hot potato held by no one.
At work I'm happier then I was at home only a few months ago. I don't know what it was, but I believe this is part of the fallout of a change I experienced in June.
Let Go
My over all feeling is much more relaxed and open then it has been. The past month or so I've re-focused my meditation with very good results. Happiness is steadily increasing, hard for it not too when most tension is released as it arises and I return my mind to a light and open state. If I'm able to stay on top of the arising tension, everything is very pleasant. If some tension slips by my awareness and it becomes an emotion I've found an easy way to release it. I simply ask "who is angry(sad, frustrated etc.)" and the tension and emotion just drop away, like a hot potato held by no one.
At work I'm happier then I was at home only a few months ago. I don't know what it was, but I believe this is part of the fallout of a change I experienced in June.
Let Go
- jgroove
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70389
by jgroove
Replied by jgroove on topic RE: A beginners Journal
Awesome.
- JLaurelC
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70390
by JLaurelC
Replied by JLaurelC on topic RE: A beginners Journal
I am so glad to hear this. Please continue to keep us posted!
- RevElev
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70391
by RevElev
Replied by RevElev on topic RE: A beginners Journal
Joel, and Laurel,
Thanks for the encouragement!
Noticed something happening yesterday. Without thinking I react to situations the way I always have, even though the emotion/passion that used to motivate the action is missing. For instance, I react as though I'm frustrated with my gf leaving the lid off the toothpaste(an example), even though the frustration isn't really there. I see it begin to arise let it go, then "I" react the same as if it(frustration) was there anyway. Weird. I guess that's just something else to be mindful of, or maybe this will fade away as I watch it, like the emotions seem to be doing. Or maybe something else altogether...I don't know,and I'm really getting to like the not knowing.
Great site for books, talks, etc:http://www.budsas.org/ebud/ebidx.htm
Thanks for the encouragement!
Noticed something happening yesterday. Without thinking I react to situations the way I always have, even though the emotion/passion that used to motivate the action is missing. For instance, I react as though I'm frustrated with my gf leaving the lid off the toothpaste(an example), even though the frustration isn't really there. I see it begin to arise let it go, then "I" react the same as if it(frustration) was there anyway. Weird. I guess that's just something else to be mindful of, or maybe this will fade away as I watch it, like the emotions seem to be doing. Or maybe something else altogether...I don't know,and I'm really getting to like the not knowing.
Great site for books, talks, etc:http://www.budsas.org/ebud/ebidx.htm
- RevElev
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70392
by RevElev
Replied by RevElev on topic RE: A beginners Journal
Ramblings from my morning sit:
Tension=suffering. I create tension by grasping, onto things, ideas, emotions, people. Possessing does not create suffering, grasping onto things/possessions does. Anything can become an object of grasping/desire. Ideas about who I am seem to be most prominent however. Good/bad, attractive/ugly, smart/dumb, rich/poor. It doesn't matter which, holding onto any of them causes tension/suffering.
They are all like a shard of broken glass in the palm of my hand, if I don't grasp onto it I can have it and not suffer, the moment I grasp onto it, tension occurs in my arm/hand, the hand closes and I suffer. Not because of the glass, but because of the tension.
This really clarified the importance of generosity and poverty in religion. It is a forced letting go of possessions. A way to see the suffering caused by holding tightly to what we possess, idea/person/emotion, or object.
To end suffering I must stop holding anything, let go of everything. Hold nothing, be nothing. Like a tree allowing the wind to blow through it's branches, not trying to grasp the wind. The tree suffers when the resistance to the wind becomes too great, then branches break. Tension arises, suffering occurs.
To hold nothing is to be the Taoist ideal of the empty vessel, it can hold the entire universe.
Now I have to let go of this idea, or suffer.
Sorry for the preachy tone. This is one of those things I've known intellectually for a while, but I actually saw it clearly in my experience this morning.
Tension=suffering. I create tension by grasping, onto things, ideas, emotions, people. Possessing does not create suffering, grasping onto things/possessions does. Anything can become an object of grasping/desire. Ideas about who I am seem to be most prominent however. Good/bad, attractive/ugly, smart/dumb, rich/poor. It doesn't matter which, holding onto any of them causes tension/suffering.
They are all like a shard of broken glass in the palm of my hand, if I don't grasp onto it I can have it and not suffer, the moment I grasp onto it, tension occurs in my arm/hand, the hand closes and I suffer. Not because of the glass, but because of the tension.
This really clarified the importance of generosity and poverty in religion. It is a forced letting go of possessions. A way to see the suffering caused by holding tightly to what we possess, idea/person/emotion, or object.
To end suffering I must stop holding anything, let go of everything. Hold nothing, be nothing. Like a tree allowing the wind to blow through it's branches, not trying to grasp the wind. The tree suffers when the resistance to the wind becomes too great, then branches break. Tension arises, suffering occurs.
To hold nothing is to be the Taoist ideal of the empty vessel, it can hold the entire universe.
Now I have to let go of this idea, or suffer.
Sorry for the preachy tone. This is one of those things I've known intellectually for a while, but I actually saw it clearly in my experience this morning.
- RevElev
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70393
by RevElev
Replied by RevElev on topic RE: A beginners Journal
Yesterday morning I realized something about "me". This was similar to my previous post, in that it blew me away at the time, but now just seems so obvious.
The "I", that I've known for some time doesn't really exist, has always seemed like some sort of big monolithic thing/object. Possibly because that's how it feels. But, it suddenly occurred to me that "I" am not a thing, but a story. "Brian" is not an object, but the culmination of his past put into a narrative that supports who I think I am. "The Life of Brian", couldn't resist
I've been attempting to nurture certain aspects of myself, compassion, love, empathy and decrease others, like anger, greed, jealousy. But this can't work(ultimately) because it's all just part of the same fiction, that is "Brian". Certain aspects of the story aren't the problem, believing that the story is reality is the problem. This is why trying to have spiritual experiences, while fun, won't resolve anything at a fundamental level, it just solves fictitious problems in a fictitious reality. Everything"I" do is done from this story.
It's the same as being in a dream and creating peace in the middle east, a great achievement, but what has really been accomplished? To continue with the dream idea I feel like I'm lucid dreaming now. I know it's a dream, but I'm still in it. In order to wake up to reality this dream "Brian" will have to die. HaHa, so sad!
So... how do I put down this story and live in reality? Not really sure, keep doing what I have been I guess. Speaking of which, my awareness seems to have naturally moved back to my body from my breath over the past week, both on and off the cushion. The relaxation and letting go of sensations is still with me, but my attention has shifted from breath and body to body and breath. (cont)
The "I", that I've known for some time doesn't really exist, has always seemed like some sort of big monolithic thing/object. Possibly because that's how it feels. But, it suddenly occurred to me that "I" am not a thing, but a story. "Brian" is not an object, but the culmination of his past put into a narrative that supports who I think I am. "The Life of Brian", couldn't resist
I've been attempting to nurture certain aspects of myself, compassion, love, empathy and decrease others, like anger, greed, jealousy. But this can't work(ultimately) because it's all just part of the same fiction, that is "Brian". Certain aspects of the story aren't the problem, believing that the story is reality is the problem. This is why trying to have spiritual experiences, while fun, won't resolve anything at a fundamental level, it just solves fictitious problems in a fictitious reality. Everything"I" do is done from this story.
It's the same as being in a dream and creating peace in the middle east, a great achievement, but what has really been accomplished? To continue with the dream idea I feel like I'm lucid dreaming now. I know it's a dream, but I'm still in it. In order to wake up to reality this dream "Brian" will have to die. HaHa, so sad!
So... how do I put down this story and live in reality? Not really sure, keep doing what I have been I guess. Speaking of which, my awareness seems to have naturally moved back to my body from my breath over the past week, both on and off the cushion. The relaxation and letting go of sensations is still with me, but my attention has shifted from breath and body to body and breath. (cont)
- RevElev
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70394
by RevElev
Replied by RevElev on topic RE: A beginners Journal
A subtle difference, but it seems to have occurred naturally(no push from me) and it feels very different. Much more sensation based.
I find it very interesting that this sort of thing happens. Of course it may just be that I'm fooling myself into thinking I intuitively have some vague idea what I'm doing. But, it seems like these shifts help my practice, although it's way to early to tell, I'll report back in 5 years with a more definitive answer on that one.
Be Well
I find it very interesting that this sort of thing happens. Of course it may just be that I'm fooling myself into thinking I intuitively have some vague idea what I'm doing. But, it seems like these shifts help my practice, although it's way to early to tell, I'll report back in 5 years with a more definitive answer on that one.
Be Well
- RevElev
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70395
by RevElev
Replied by RevElev on topic RE: A beginners Journal
The incongruence between the story that "I" am and real life is creating a subtle low grade, but constant tension in me. Whenever my reality doesn't match my story, I need to change one to decrease tension/suffering. Which makes for a ridiculously complex reality. I meditate, therefore I am calm and compassionate, if I give someone the finger in traffic...boom! Tension because the story known as Brian doesn't match reality. Now I have to create harmony between the story and the experience, and until I do I will suffer. I'll suffer after I create harmony as well, but it will decrease. I'm only human, had a bad day, had a fight with the girlfriend, need to meditate more, that guy could've killed me...anything to explain away the clash. And the entire kit-and-kaboodle is a fiction. No bloody wonder we're all half crazy!! Or half of us are all crazy, or whatever!
- RevElev
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70396
by RevElev
Replied by RevElev on topic RE: A beginners Journal
Focusing more on the physical sensations while sitting has thrown me back into a lot of the ol' energetic stuff. Swirling pressure in my head, lights in the visual field, third eye pressure. My ability to remain aware of the entire body(off the cushion) has increased a lot in the last week or two. I'm not sure if it's direct mode or not.
My understanding of DM is that it is accompanied by a feeling of fascination with one's surroundings, eg..usually mundane things look really cool suddenly. This goes along with feeling thoughts and emotions in the body. The awareness of thoughts and emotions as physical sensations is often present, but it seems like the change in visual perception requires an extra effort put into concentration. Not sure if this is normal or maybe not even DM.? This is resulting in me noticing a lot of difference in the quality of my awareness. It's so rewarding when it's heightened, but frustrating when I'm tired and it's lagging a little. Probably normal, but still occasionally frustrating.
On a more upbeat and funny note, someone tried to get into an argument with me yesterday, but I was able to stay present in my body, watch the emotions arise and not get involved with them. I just ended up agreeing with the person because I had no interest in arguing (I normally would have taken the bait). They ended up getting really pissed off at me because I didn't want to play the game. I didn't do it to upset them, I just realized the pointlessness in arguing over a trivial matter that I really had no stake in. It freaked me out a bit, because I stayed calm (emotions were definitely present in the body, but I didn't get involved with them).
My understanding of DM is that it is accompanied by a feeling of fascination with one's surroundings, eg..usually mundane things look really cool suddenly. This goes along with feeling thoughts and emotions in the body. The awareness of thoughts and emotions as physical sensations is often present, but it seems like the change in visual perception requires an extra effort put into concentration. Not sure if this is normal or maybe not even DM.? This is resulting in me noticing a lot of difference in the quality of my awareness. It's so rewarding when it's heightened, but frustrating when I'm tired and it's lagging a little. Probably normal, but still occasionally frustrating.
On a more upbeat and funny note, someone tried to get into an argument with me yesterday, but I was able to stay present in my body, watch the emotions arise and not get involved with them. I just ended up agreeing with the person because I had no interest in arguing (I normally would have taken the bait). They ended up getting really pissed off at me because I didn't want to play the game. I didn't do it to upset them, I just realized the pointlessness in arguing over a trivial matter that I really had no stake in. It freaked me out a bit, because I stayed calm (emotions were definitely present in the body, but I didn't get involved with them).
- RevElev
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70397
by RevElev
Replied by RevElev on topic RE: A beginners Journal
Still focusing on the body, as mentioned above, and experiencing (maybe) nanas again. Flashes in A&P, distracting thoughts in dukkha nanas, and peace in equanimity. EQ is also showing me some eyelid flickering, light flashes and moving energy. Or, I'm mistaken about it all. But, it sure feels similar to the lead up to first path.
Wednesday I ran HAIETMOBA through my mind as I was walking home, and it had an effect for the first time. I seemed to get pulled forward and experienced my surroundings in a significantly more direct way. It was like I was out meeting life instead of sitting and waiting for it to come to me. It only lasted about 5 seconds, but I did it 4 times. Previously whenever I asked the question the result has been the same as if I asked "what is the boiling point of water?" Nothing happened. It still changes the way I perceive my surroundings, it brings me to the present and lets me relax and smile and enjoy now.
For some reason it seems to be clicking, the idea of naivety also makes sense. All the AF practices have really rung hollow for me, now they seem to make sense and I can relate them to my practice. Apparently some change has occurred which has aligned me with the practice. I have no intention to stop meditating, but it feels like some new methods are suddenly available to me to work with.
Wednesday I ran HAIETMOBA through my mind as I was walking home, and it had an effect for the first time. I seemed to get pulled forward and experienced my surroundings in a significantly more direct way. It was like I was out meeting life instead of sitting and waiting for it to come to me. It only lasted about 5 seconds, but I did it 4 times. Previously whenever I asked the question the result has been the same as if I asked "what is the boiling point of water?" Nothing happened. It still changes the way I perceive my surroundings, it brings me to the present and lets me relax and smile and enjoy now.
For some reason it seems to be clicking, the idea of naivety also makes sense. All the AF practices have really rung hollow for me, now they seem to make sense and I can relate them to my practice. Apparently some change has occurred which has aligned me with the practice. I have no intention to stop meditating, but it feels like some new methods are suddenly available to me to work with.
- RevElev
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70398
by RevElev
Replied by RevElev on topic RE: A beginners Journal
Just posted on another thread, and realized just how effortless this process has become for me. I'm still sitting twice a day for 45 minutes, and maintaining constant(as close as I can anyway) awareness. But there is almost no feeling of effort, and the benefits in my daily life are increasing. This feels like a snowball rolling downhill, picking up momentum and speed.
Twice this week I've walked away from arguments with a loved one that would have sucked me in only a couple months ago. And by not reacting the other person seemed to becomes somewhat disarmed and it was over, we got back to enjoying each others company instead of spending hours at each others throats. My "baseline" seems to have moved up noticeably in the last week~.
The basics of AF are proving useful to me at the moment. I can't stand the way the site is set up or written, but some of the techniques are productive.
Twice this week I've walked away from arguments with a loved one that would have sucked me in only a couple months ago. And by not reacting the other person seemed to becomes somewhat disarmed and it was over, we got back to enjoying each others company instead of spending hours at each others throats. My "baseline" seems to have moved up noticeably in the last week~.
The basics of AF are proving useful to me at the moment. I can't stand the way the site is set up or written, but some of the techniques are productive.
- mumuwu
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70399
by mumuwu
Replied by mumuwu on topic RE: A beginners Journal
Good stuff Rev. Always great to hear that a yogi's practice is making a positive impact on their life.
What technique are you doing in your sits?
What technique are you doing in your sits?
- RevElev
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70400
by RevElev
Replied by RevElev on topic RE: A beginners Journal
mumuwu,
Thanks for the comment. Technique? Well, I basically start with the breath and then once I settle I just keep my awareness with the sensations that arise. The "settling" that I'm referring to occurs around what I believe is equanimity. This takes about 20 minutes. My experience then really opens, expands etc. During this open phase I get a lot of swirling pressure in the head.
Thanks for the comment. Technique? Well, I basically start with the breath and then once I settle I just keep my awareness with the sensations that arise. The "settling" that I'm referring to occurs around what I believe is equanimity. This takes about 20 minutes. My experience then really opens, expands etc. During this open phase I get a lot of swirling pressure in the head.
- mumuwu
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70401
by mumuwu
Replied by mumuwu on topic RE: A beginners Journal
Cool stuff Rev. Do you find yourself going through DN type stuff for a while during that 20 minute period?
- RevElev
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70402
by RevElev
Replied by RevElev on topic RE: A beginners Journal
"Cool stuff Rev. Do you find yourself going through DN type stuff for a while during that 20 minute period?"
Absolutely, that's a big reason I feel like I'm in equanimity. The discomfort and thoughts end, I relax and things expand, and become still for a while. Then energy and flashing begin.
Absolutely, that's a big reason I feel like I'm in equanimity. The discomfort and thoughts end, I relax and things expand, and become still for a while. Then energy and flashing begin.
- RevElev
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70403
by RevElev
Replied by RevElev on topic RE: A beginners Journal
Experienced a lot of spinning and outward projected energy/pressure at the third eye this am while sitting. This occurred after I had been in (what I consider) Eq for about 10 minutes.
I also regularly experience the opposite. It feels like a subtle energy is entering my head at the third eye, this only lasts a minute, maybe two. It feels like the third eye opens inward, almost like a funnel into my head.
Again, could anyone direct me to the written descriptions/explanations of the post 4th path stages of Kenneth's enlightenment model. I can't for the life of me find it, it's probably right in front of me though.
I also regularly experience the opposite. It feels like a subtle energy is entering my head at the third eye, this only lasts a minute, maybe two. It feels like the third eye opens inward, almost like a funnel into my head.
Again, could anyone direct me to the written descriptions/explanations of the post 4th path stages of Kenneth's enlightenment model. I can't for the life of me find it, it's probably right in front of me though.
- nadavspi
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70404
by nadavspi
Replied by nadavspi on topic RE: A beginners Journal
You know about the videos, right?
Not written of course, but I don't think there's an "official" written description at this point.
Not written of course, but I don't think there's an "official" written description at this point.
- RevElev
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70405
by RevElev
Replied by RevElev on topic RE: A beginners Journal
nadavspi,
Thanks I've watched the videos, but I prefer, and learn better from text.
I'd just assumed that something would have been written by now. If I remember correctly the 8th stage isn't included in the videos either.
I'm also slightly curious about the lack of openness on these stages. Why the secrecy??
Thanks I've watched the videos, but I prefer, and learn better from text.
I'd just assumed that something would have been written by now. If I remember correctly the 8th stage isn't included in the videos either.
I'm also slightly curious about the lack of openness on these stages. Why the secrecy??
- RevElev
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70406
by RevElev
Replied by RevElev on topic RE: A beginners Journal
My happiness has increased over the last two days in almost direct proportion to how much my desire to sit has decreased. The feeling of effortlessness and happiness continue to increase.
I'm starting a second job today, so my practice time and posting will probably drop somewhat.
I'm starting a second job today, so my practice time and posting will probably drop somewhat.
- mumuwu
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70408
by mumuwu
Replied by mumuwu on topic RE: A beginners Journal
Rev,
Are you thinking A&P or equanimity (re: the happiness / lack of desire for sitting)?
Are you thinking A&P or equanimity (re: the happiness / lack of desire for sitting)?
- mumuwu
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70407
by mumuwu
Replied by mumuwu on topic RE: A beginners Journal
I think 8th stage is simply left at "end of developmental enlightenment" at this point rather than some sort of end to unnecessary thoughts.
In terms of stage 6 & 7, those have been described in the videos as well as a post on the forum accompanying that. No secrecy, just new and not as relevant as stage 1-5 to most people visiting the site.
In terms of stage 6 & 7, those have been described in the videos as well as a post on the forum accompanying that. No secrecy, just new and not as relevant as stage 1-5 to most people visiting the site.
- RevElev
- Topic Author
14 years 4 months ago #70409
by RevElev
Replied by RevElev on topic RE: A beginners Journal
I'd guess EQ, but really not sure. I seem to end up in EQ at the end of my meditation sessions though.
- RevElev
- Topic Author
14 years 3 months ago #70410
by RevElev
Replied by RevElev on topic RE: A beginners Journal
Forcing my practice the last two days, incorporating new things(HAIETMOBA) and getting twisted around trying to force what "I" think is the right way.
Or...DN, not sure which. Irritable in the extreme and a stabbing pain in my left ear and top of my head. Spent 1/2 hr in a park this afternoon just being aware of my senses, and the bad mood seems to have lifted, along with the stabbing.
I still get caught up in trying to push this stuff, even though I know it doesn't work. Silly Rabbit!!
Or...DN, not sure which. Irritable in the extreme and a stabbing pain in my left ear and top of my head. Spent 1/2 hr in a park this afternoon just being aware of my senses, and the bad mood seems to have lifted, along with the stabbing.
I still get caught up in trying to push this stuff, even though I know it doesn't work. Silly Rabbit!!
