Russell's practice thread

Well after my chat with Ron last night I realize even more how much I need to let go. He thinks I keep shifting from high to low equanimity and back and forth because I am efforting too much. For example, when focusing my attention on my 3rd eye area, I almost strain looking at it and then it dissolves and I get bored again until the vibrations arise again, focus, dissolve, then repeat. Note to self: softer, gentler focus and expand awareness.

Took Ron's advice and paid very close attention to 'Right Effort' and not 'Too Much Effort' and it helped a lot. Stayed in High EQ much longer and no longer dipped back down into lower EQ last night. However, as usual, my morning sit remained kinda blah, but thats ok, it usually gets the momentum going pretty strong.

A little fustrated with myself. Haven't been practicing as much as I would like. more like only 45min to 1 hour a day vs the 2+ I was doing. I think its the boredom factor with EQ. But I did sit for 20 minutes this morning and will sit again tonight. Finding it really hard to note anymore, it kind of drops off and I just sit with open awareness.

Hang in there and don't lose momentum! You're getting closer and closer.

Thank Ron. I refuse to let a day go by where I don't sit no matter what comes up. I am stubborn like that. I had a nice sit last night. Total yesterday was somewhere over an hour or so. Last night, things were very clear and very vibratory. My wife had a cough in the background and at one point I found myself focusing on her suffering like it was my own as she coughed. I could feel her coughs like vibrations in my body. Then I got that rising energy that felt like it wanted to bust through my crown again, but I noticed I was wincing a bit, tried to relax my eyes, and the energy calmed down. It feels like when that happens, something big is about to happen, but somehow, I am still unable to "let it" it seems.

" My wife had a cough in the background and at one point I found myself focusing on her suffering like it was my own as she coughed. I could feel her coughs like vibrations in my body. "

This is a wonderful and real benefit from this practice. Empathy that is deep and visceral - what most people think of as "compassion" doesn't really do it justice. Thanks for sharing it with us.

Thanks Ron. That sparked me to think more about what I have learned from this practice so far even though I feel like I have suffered a lot in recent years. Although I still suffer with what feels like illness/anxiety daily. I have moments of clarity and less suffering. The main things I have noticed are:

- I used to have lots of craving and attachments. I would get fixated on acquiring the latest gadget or whatever. I can easily let that stuff go now and realize it was just causing suffering.

- I have more compassion for people who are suffering.

- I have less spiritual attachments. I used to be attached to a certain spot/room/cushion to sit and meditate. I couldn't be disturbed or even have the thought of potentially being disturbed or I would have self-doubt thoughts the entire sit and couldn't get concentrated. I can meditate anywhere now (sitting in a chair, laying down) and even with others in the room etc... I also have buddha statues that I collected etc. None of that matters to me any more. I realize it is so much bigger than attachments. Even the attachment to attain stream-entry (while obvious something I have resolved to attain) is not as strong and I have realized it will happen if I just let go.

Sitting notes: Sat for a little less than an hour yesterday. 1st sit, I hung around in low EQ and got interrupted by my daughter so I ended the sit and decided to sit again later. The later sit I could easily get concentrated, and eventually found myself in high EQ but noticed a shift to lower EQ with a little headache straining and decided I needed to go to bed.

2 X 30 minute sits yesterday. Very similar to Saturday's sits. I get pretty bored and am a little discouraged but thats the name of the game.

I had 3 x 30-40 min sits yesterday. It seems I am just getting to the really good stuff when either I get interupted or end up straining too hard and shift down again. And despite being in EQ I am having the worst anxiety of my entire life off the cushion. Periods of almost-non functioning are coming into play and I don't know what to do about it.

"And despite being in EQ I am having the worst anxiety of my entire life off the cushion. Periods of almost-non functioning are coming into play and I don't know what to do about it."

For what it's worth, I've gone through this too -- and actually might be in the same situation the last two days -- the anxiety is showing up as nightmares and insomnia, with just shadows of anxiety during the day.

I tend to think of it as life on the boundary between Reobservation and EQ.

Reobservation is having your "hot buttons" pushed -- whatever feels vunerable in your life: job, relationships, mortality, money, family, property, and general outlook on life. There is always some way of thinking or feeling about these subjects that makes us uncomfortable or anxious, and those thoughts and feelings show up in Reobs. The trick is to remember to recognize that they are thoughts and emotions and only that. They are not necessarily predictive of the future (even though they seem so accurate and applicable). And then it's time to get close to those thoughts and feelings. Objectify them but don't discount them. Feel what it is like to have that thought, to have that feeling. Feel how the "protection instinct" creates all these thoughts and how this instinct is an elaborate way of running away.

Reobs is the realm of the "cult leader" who is paranoid and tries to come up with elaborate ways of denying or suppressing or fixing all of our most serious concerns. What a great opportunity to see how this persona works, how it tries to manipulate you to start controlling things! Once the phenominon of Reobs are seen this way, eventually you realize that there really is nothing to be done to fix all of these worries, the worries are endless and some might be true some might be false, who can know the future? So you give up, surrender, you are exhausted... and then you are on the doorstep of EQ.

In my case, I spent the last two nights meditating from 12PM to 1AM, going through all the negative sensations... and then winding up with a hint of low EQ. The added concentration of sitting allowed EQ to arrive. I suspect that might be what's happening to you: concentration during sit = EQ, distractions of life = falling back to Reobs.

Hope this helps!


edit - more explanation of cult leader

Thanks for the help. You may be right on key. I am getting less cushion time in the last week or so..could be slipping back a little bit. I will do my best to recognize theis stuff for what it is and nothing more.

OK, I have been hesitant to post for the last couple of days because I think I may have gotten 1st path 2 nights ago but I wanted to talk to Ron first before jumping the gun. So, I talked to Ron last night and here is how it has been going:

This major anxiety this week has been terrible, but I think it was there for a reason. I had some amazing insights into thoughts and thought patterns in a sit 2 nights ago. So while I have been able to look at physical sensations as not me, lately in my sits I had been getting caught up in thoughts like crazy and was very frustrated, thinking I was slipping back. Until 2 nights ago I tried to take them on by using some of the techniques that I have seen Kenneth and Ron talk about on the forum. Asking my thoughts to show themselves and seeing what I will think up next made me suddenly clearly see that my thoughts are not me. I started having all of these rediculous thoughts and I was like: Hey, I'm not doing this, it is just happening on its own.

So, after this sit, which felt very liberating and insightful. I went to lay in bed and just do some concentration practice focusing on the breath, and in a pitch black room, with my eyes closed, suddenly it was like a blind lowered slowly across my field of vision to an even darker black and then i got a little chill (tremble) and a "what was that?" but since I have had a few near misses I thought nothing of it and went to sleep.

Next morning, I noticed that my usual busy mind in the morning was still busy but as I was having some negative thoughts or body sensations, I was a little separate from them, watching them, and not getting stuck in my anxiety feedback loops of negativity. Then as the day went on I had the same anxiety but I had a little distance from it. However, the energy level in my body was so high I felt like I was wigging out a bit. Other things noticed... (cont..)

(...cont) I have a compassion for strangers like I havent seen in the past. I just want everyone to be happy. Been a little giggly for no reason at times too. Also, Ron, told me to sit before we talked. So I tried to sit and immediately had bright lights and intense A&P like feelings that were very intense (eyes squinting, jaw clenching almost) I also tried some jhana jumping with some success, nothing very deep though although I could feel different states and eye focus changes when I told my mind to go to a specific jhana. I actually had to lay down after 15 minutes for the rest of the sit cause it was very intense.

I still have some self-doubt about what happened, but I think that is normal with anything like this, but something feels different. Anyways, if it ends up being a miss, I gained some fantastic insights into thoughts and how they and just like any physical sensation, not me.

So, I did talk to Ron last night and he is pretty sure it was Stream Entry, but obviously we are waiting a week or so to see if I am in Review or not and to let the dust settle. I could not sleep last night. I feel like I maybe slept for a couple of hours, but I feel ok today. However, I just went to try to sneak away for a quick sit and the energy levels and anxiety have pumped up again.

This sounds really familiar. We'll stay tuned!

Wow, that sounds very good! I really hope it's the real deal!

I hope so as well though, hard not to have my doubts, I felt pretty normal today when I woke up, then I tried to do a short sit, which left me with so much buzzing energy that I really should have just not gone to work. I have finally calmed down again for now and I'm not going to sit again at least until i am relaxed and in the safety of my home tonight. Still something feel different, however, I have a lot of doubts just because it's just one of those things that I can't believe can happen to me. I am assuming that is pretty normal though.

Echoing Laurel, this does sound familiar. You might consider make some formal resolutions regarding your practice. Right after Stream Entry, resolutions tend to have more sticking power than you might expect. A resolution I've used is "May I attain to the next path as quickly as reasonably possible, for the benefit of all being."

Otherwise, enjoy and be curious about the experience, including all the doubt, joy, uncertainty, fear, elation, all of which can happen within a very short time of each other. It can be quite a roller-coaster ride sometimes.

Thank you. I plan on making some resolutions just like that right before my sit tonight!

Overall, had some tough times today and some really truly great times today. When it was bad, I did feel like I got caught up in the anxiety a quite a bit, but when it was good it felt the best I have felt in probably 3-4 years. Ears unclogged, not dizzy, seeing clearly.

Anyways, I am pretty sure I am in Review. My sitting experience is VERY different than the last month or so where I would shoot up to EQ very quickly without noticing the DN stuff or A&P much at all. Tonight I just sat and had pretty intense A&P for what seems like 5 minutes almost. It was so easy to note though, just rolling fast. Then I noticed dissolution because the noting got sloppy, then the DN stuff was mixed up a bit, but this is the first time in a while where I clearly saw disgust and misery. Had the grimaces and itches and all. Then things smoothed out to EQ, but then it seems to get more fuzzy, I am not sure if I went up to high EQ and that was it, or if I had an unnoticeable cessation and went back to A&P. Hard to tell, but I did get a bit rapturous and lights after being in EQ for a fairly short time. All of this happened within 25-30 minutes. I'll keep reporting.

Yep. Congrats.

"Yep. Congrats. "

Thank you. I have made my resolutions and trekking on. Still feel the strong changes in energy this morning and it took me a while to get to sleep last night. Kind of hoping this will calm down here soon, but trying to dissembed from the sensations all the same.

Quick question RE: jhana jumping. I have tried this a couple times and I definitely can notice shifts and changes when I try it but it is more subtle than I have experienced in the past. Is this normal? Will it grow/change/intensify with practice? Also, I was wondering if it could be useful if I am feeling anxious to step away to somewhere quiet and go into say, 4th jhana (hopefully brewing up some equanimity towards things) steep for a minute or so and then return to what I was doing.

Congrats! What exciting stuff!

As for your question, others can chime in on this as well and offer their opinions, but I found that the jhanas were more subtle than I expected after SE. I could tune to them but they didn't suddenly blast into being, it was more faint than that. However, I found that if I got very concentrated first, then tuned to a jhana, it would be much stronger.

As for using jhanas to manage anxiety - go for it! That is a way better solution than what most people use. Just be clear in your mind that this is what you are doing it for and don't get your intentions about the sit mixed up. Hope that helps - congrats again!

Hi Russell,

My experience was like Ron's - jhana jumping immediately after stream entry was vague, and honestly not very rewarding. I would use this time to just sit and let the process unfold naturally. The jhanas will probably become more clear with time, and it can be fun (and helpful for the future) to start to pay attention to the shifts you experience while you sit.

I did a write up of a very helpful session I had with Kenneth soon after I got 1st path. You might find it helpful to orient yourself to the review cycle and start to gain some mastery over the jhanas as we talk about them here. Let me dig it up... kennethfolkdharma.wetpaint.com/thread/40...et=200&maxResults=20 starting post #201

Regarding your question about using the jhanas in daily life, I think this is a great time to experiment with that. Dunno if it'll work for you, but Kenneth's Mahamudra pointer of listening to the ships in the harbor (knowing you can't hear them) was very useful and profound for me during review and usually revealed 4th jhana.

Remember that it will take some time for this to settle. Things will definitely calm down. Review was a very enjoyable time for me, so I was in no rush to get out of it and start the next path. Of course, stream entry was also when I realized this stuff happens on its own accord when the conditions are ripe...